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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Automotive industry provides $13 million jobs, generates $10 billion in tax revenue]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 08:41:49 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>We Need More Capitalists</strong></p><p><br>
The problem is that industries want to be socialized at a time of new technology -- when we need capitalists more than ever before!</p><p>
The auto industry is a case in point. &nbsp; Like most Dow companies, building cars is now a commodity business. &nbsp;Even the more esoteric technologies like hybrid are getting cheaper as you say. &nbsp;And with the eventual rise of fuel cell cars, that have only one engine, cars get ever simpler to build, and maintain.</p><p>
It would be stupid to pour more money into a shrinking business like autos, at a time where we need to fund the new industries like Green, alternative energy, nanotechnologies and web-semantic technologies.</p><p>
The problem is this: too much capital has been tied up in declining DOW industries. &nbsp;We need to move that capital into the hands of individuals.</p><p>
At this point, the Government should be a virtual feeding through for people. &nbsp;We should be putting grants of $80,000 or $100,000 there for the taking -- whether someone wants to create the next material for hydrogen storage or simply wants to figure out a way to turn wangsters on the street corner into local aldermen. &nbsp; </p><p>
We need to decouple the individual, with all his brain power and talent, from the machine organization, which uses only 1 percent of his ability.</p><p>
Every person should have the same rights and funding as these businesses. &nbsp;</br></p>
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				<p><strong>We Need More Capitalists</strong></p><p><br>
The problem is that industries want to be socialized at a time of new technology -- when we need capitalists more than ever before!</p><p>
The auto industry is a case in point. &nbsp; Like most Dow companies, building cars is now a commodity business. &nbsp;Even the more esoteric technologies like hybrid are getting cheaper as you say. &nbsp;And with the eventual rise of fuel cell cars, that have only one engine, cars get ever simpler to build, and maintain.</p><p>
It would be stupid to pour more money into a shrinking business like autos, at a time where we need to fund the new industries like Green, alternative energy, nanotechnologies and web-semantic technologies.</p><p>
The problem is this: too much capital has been tied up in declining DOW industries. &nbsp;We need to move that capital into the hands of individuals.</p><p>
At this point, the Government should be a virtual feeding through for people. &nbsp;We should be putting grants of $80,000 or $100,000 there for the taking -- whether someone wants to create the next material for hydrogen storage or simply wants to figure out a way to turn wangsters on the street corner into local aldermen. &nbsp; </p><p>
We need to decouple the individual, with all his brain power and talent, from the machine organization, which uses only 1 percent of his ability.</p><p>
Every person should have the same rights and funding as these businesses. &nbsp;</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Luddhunter2</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 08:58:54 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Bailout THIS</strong></p><p>Ditto jabailo on capitalists, but pouring money into green tech only makes sense where science-intensive basic research is needed to validate promising theoretical technology, such as high-yield solar cells.</p><p>
But I must rant on the bailout mentality.</p><p>
The statist handout begging whiners from the left and the rightwing-monopolist-oligarch-sucking punks must be creaming in teir collectivist/fascistic jeans over these daily bailout calls. &nbsp;This is the 72 green smelly virgins they dreamt of when their pillowbiting Knight in Shimmery Satin, Barney Frank, and his p_ss-boy Chris Dodd, and the libertarian-in-name-only Alan Greenspan aided the sabotage of the housing market years ago. &nbsp;The inevitable socialist/fascist bailout coup going on now must be like a never-ending orgasm for the Leviathan-knob-slobbers.</p><p>
F_ckin parasites, all of them. But be careful what you wish for. There is only so much tax extortion money you can use. &nbsp;They can't bail out every bloated, overregulated, govt co-opted, union-slacker-infested dinosaur company. &nbsp;Some will die a horrible death, with screwdriver turning union idiots losing their 45$/hr jobs that would be $10/hr in a free market, and losing their pensions, and having to work their last 5 years for Toyota at 1/3 the pay. &nbsp;Justice served for parasiting for so many years.</p><p>
And when the money runs out, the useless unionized b_stards might just have to compete and add value to stay employed. &nbsp;Or do they all still run to their mommies and breast-feed when for comfort when they worry about having to get a real job?</p><p>
No charge for the Luddhunter's tough love today.</p>
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				<p><strong>Bailout THIS</strong></p><p>Ditto jabailo on capitalists, but pouring money into green tech only makes sense where science-intensive basic research is needed to validate promising theoretical technology, such as high-yield solar cells.</p><p>
But I must rant on the bailout mentality.</p><p>
The statist handout begging whiners from the left and the rightwing-monopolist-oligarch-sucking punks must be creaming in teir collectivist/fascistic jeans over these daily bailout calls. &nbsp;This is the 72 green smelly virgins they dreamt of when their pillowbiting Knight in Shimmery Satin, Barney Frank, and his p_ss-boy Chris Dodd, and the libertarian-in-name-only Alan Greenspan aided the sabotage of the housing market years ago. &nbsp;The inevitable socialist/fascist bailout coup going on now must be like a never-ending orgasm for the Leviathan-knob-slobbers.</p><p>
F_ckin parasites, all of them. But be careful what you wish for. There is only so much tax extortion money you can use. &nbsp;They can't bail out every bloated, overregulated, govt co-opted, union-slacker-infested dinosaur company. &nbsp;Some will die a horrible death, with screwdriver turning union idiots losing their 45$/hr jobs that would be $10/hr in a free market, and losing their pensions, and having to work their last 5 years for Toyota at 1/3 the pay. &nbsp;Justice served for parasiting for so many years.</p><p>
And when the money runs out, the useless unionized b_stards might just have to compete and add value to stay employed. &nbsp;Or do they all still run to their mommies and breast-feed when for comfort when they worry about having to get a real job?</p><p>
No charge for the Luddhunter's tough love today.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by Tasermons Partner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:42:30 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>20 years too late...</strong></p><p>Our industry plans to be on the leading edge of the new energy economy. Our work towards meeting a national solution could create the biggest wave of "green jobs" our nation has seen as automakers produce more cars that use less fuel and produce less carbon dioxide.</p><p>
Dude, the Japanese and Korean car companies already did that...20 years ago.</p><p>
And you expect the Americans to catch up with them in just a few years?</p><p>
Yes, we've all heard 'bout the Chevy Volt and a few of the other more innovative models, but even according to the industries own predictions, they don't plan on pushing those models into a significant portion of the overall production.</p><p>
Why? &nbsp;Because they think it's "less cost efficient" to produce that more "conventional" models.</p><p>
And yet, had they focused on those more innovative models to begin with, their companies wouldn't be hittin' bottom right 'bout now.</p><p>
Ironic, no? </p><p>
Plus, the number of jobs provided and the economic impact that you quoted in your article are for the automobile industry as a whole...including foreign car companies. &nbsp;In fact, a significant amount of the jobs and economic impact are from foreign companies.</p><p>
The thing is, the foreign car companies aren't in danger of collapse.</p><p>
They just want a bailout primarily for American car companies, which actually produce far less vehicles for the American public than the foreign companies do.</p><p>
The thing is, foreign car companies, in general, are far more efficient, have better gas mileage, safety features, require less maintenance, and have better customer satisfaction ratings than the American companies do.</p><p>
And their vehicles are generally comparable (or cheaper) in price.</p><p>
And it's not like they're takin' away American jobs. &nbsp;The majority of cars produced by foreign car companies and sold in America are made in America.</p><p>
At plants that are on American soil and hire Americans to work 'em.</p><p>
And unlike the American companies, they aren't subsidized by our own government to nearly the same extent.</p><p>
So, the question is, with the foreign car companies already producing better products, at reasonable prices, by using American workers, why, exactly, should we subsidize (more than we already have) the American car companies who, in fact, now make up a minority of the cars sold in the country?</p><p>
They say they need to money to increase production on fuel efficient vehicles...why not just go with the car companies that ALREADY make fuel efficient vehicles, and have done so for decades?</p><p>
Afterall, the best way to increase America's fuel efficieny would be if the companies who make the most inefficient vehicles went under and stopped production.</p><p>
Then, everyone would buy and drive the more fuel-efficent vehicles produced by the other companies.</p>
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				<p><strong>20 years too late...</strong></p><p>Our industry plans to be on the leading edge of the new energy economy. Our work towards meeting a national solution could create the biggest wave of "green jobs" our nation has seen as automakers produce more cars that use less fuel and produce less carbon dioxide.</p><p>
Dude, the Japanese and Korean car companies already did that...20 years ago.</p><p>
And you expect the Americans to catch up with them in just a few years?</p><p>
Yes, we've all heard 'bout the Chevy Volt and a few of the other more innovative models, but even according to the industries own predictions, they don't plan on pushing those models into a significant portion of the overall production.</p><p>
Why? &nbsp;Because they think it's "less cost efficient" to produce that more "conventional" models.</p><p>
And yet, had they focused on those more innovative models to begin with, their companies wouldn't be hittin' bottom right 'bout now.</p><p>
Ironic, no? </p><p>
Plus, the number of jobs provided and the economic impact that you quoted in your article are for the automobile industry as a whole...including foreign car companies. &nbsp;In fact, a significant amount of the jobs and economic impact are from foreign companies.</p><p>
The thing is, the foreign car companies aren't in danger of collapse.</p><p>
They just want a bailout primarily for American car companies, which actually produce far less vehicles for the American public than the foreign companies do.</p><p>
The thing is, foreign car companies, in general, are far more efficient, have better gas mileage, safety features, require less maintenance, and have better customer satisfaction ratings than the American companies do.</p><p>
And their vehicles are generally comparable (or cheaper) in price.</p><p>
And it's not like they're takin' away American jobs. &nbsp;The majority of cars produced by foreign car companies and sold in America are made in America.</p><p>
At plants that are on American soil and hire Americans to work 'em.</p><p>
And unlike the American companies, they aren't subsidized by our own government to nearly the same extent.</p><p>
So, the question is, with the foreign car companies already producing better products, at reasonable prices, by using American workers, why, exactly, should we subsidize (more than we already have) the American car companies who, in fact, now make up a minority of the cars sold in the country?</p><p>
They say they need to money to increase production on fuel efficient vehicles...why not just go with the car companies that ALREADY make fuel efficient vehicles, and have done so for decades?</p><p>
Afterall, the best way to increase America's fuel efficieny would be if the companies who make the most inefficient vehicles went under and stopped production.</p><p>
Then, everyone would buy and drive the more fuel-efficent vehicles produced by the other companies.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by cneal</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 13 Nov 2008 00:49:43 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>BS</strong></p><p>The American auto industry is about as important to our economy today as the ice-harvesting industry was to the economy at the turn of the century. Big and important for the time being, sure, but it's CLEARLY not the future. </p><p>
The auto industry needs a shakeup, and to accomplish it, one of the Shrinking Three needs to shut down. This industry doesn't need a bailout. It needs pure capitalism's tough love. Bankruptcy for the most inefficient firms will do more to revive the industry than Congress ever could.

<p>vigorousnorth.blogspot.com

A field guide to the wilderness areas of American inner cities.</p></p>
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				<p><strong>BS</strong></p><p>The American auto industry is about as important to our economy today as the ice-harvesting industry was to the economy at the turn of the century. Big and important for the time being, sure, but it's CLEARLY not the future. </p><p>
The auto industry needs a shakeup, and to accomplish it, one of the Shrinking Three needs to shut down. This industry doesn't need a bailout. It needs pure capitalism's tough love. Bankruptcy for the most inefficient firms will do more to revive the industry than Congress ever could.

<p>vigorousnorth.blogspot.com

A field guide to the wilderness areas of American inner cities.</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by Wolverine</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 07:31:44 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/why-the-health-of-the-auto-industry-matters-to-you/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Totally Wrong Priority</strong></p><p>First and foremost, the environment is infinitely more important than the economy. &nbsp;Anyone with a contrary view is not an environmentalist.</p><p>
Second, "what's good for GM is good for America." &nbsp;Sieg Heil! &nbsp;The auto industry, along with the other destructive industries it supports and relies upon like the oil industry, is destroying the planet. &nbsp;If Americans really want change -- and I for one don't believe for a second that they really do -- they should be willing to let this evil industry die and change to public transit for industrial transportation.</p>
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				<p><strong>Totally Wrong Priority</strong></p><p>First and foremost, the environment is infinitely more important than the economy. &nbsp;Anyone with a contrary view is not an environmentalist.</p><p>
Second, "what's good for GM is good for America." &nbsp;Sieg Heil! &nbsp;The auto industry, along with the other destructive industries it supports and relies upon like the oil industry, is destroying the planet. &nbsp;If Americans really want change -- and I for one don't believe for a second that they really do -- they should be willing to let this evil industry die and change to public transit for industrial transportation.</p>
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