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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Makower thinks the retail giant might just be turning over a new leaf]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Tom Philpott</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2005 01:51:49 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Yes, but...</strong></p><p>David, <br>
I think it's fair enough to write about Wal-Mart's efforts to "go green," so long as we keep a cold eye trained on all the egregious and non-green things the company does. </p><p>
In the grocery space, for example, its low-price/low-wage model lets its squeeze out other retailers. As it gains girth as a buyer in regional markets, it exerts downward pressure on prices paid to farmers. This effect helps put mid-sized farms out of business, transfering power to large-scale industrial farms that are often far away--meaning more travel miles built into the food on the shelf, among other depredations. </p><p>
And on. Your admirable call for dispassion also means taking care not to be blinded by the company's "green" efforts--which may or may not (we'll see) amount to PR posturing. </br></p>
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				<p><strong>Yes, but...</strong></p><p>David, <br>
I think it's fair enough to write about Wal-Mart's efforts to "go green," so long as we keep a cold eye trained on all the egregious and non-green things the company does. </p><p>
In the grocery space, for example, its low-price/low-wage model lets its squeeze out other retailers. As it gains girth as a buyer in regional markets, it exerts downward pressure on prices paid to farmers. This effect helps put mid-sized farms out of business, transfering power to large-scale industrial farms that are often far away--meaning more travel miles built into the food on the shelf, among other depredations. </p><p>
And on. Your admirable call for dispassion also means taking care not to be blinded by the company's "green" efforts--which may or may not (we'll see) amount to PR posturing. </br></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by johnilsr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2005 07:04:11 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Response to Wal-Mart Greening<p>When Wal-Mart announced it's "green" store in McKinney Texas, we responded with the following rebuttal:<p>
<a href="http://www.newrules.org/retail/news_slug.php?slugid=308" rel="nofollow">Response to Wal-Mart's New "Green" Store in McKinney, Texas - Institute for Local Self-Reliance<p>
You can find much more on the impacts of big-box developments at our <a href="http://www.newrules.org/retail/" rel="nofollow">Hometown Advantage web site

<p>John Bailey
<a href="http://www.newrules.org/" rel="nofollow">http://www.newrules.org/</a></p></a></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Response to Wal-Mart Greening<p>When Wal-Mart announced it's "green" store in McKinney Texas, we responded with the following rebuttal:<p>
<a href="http://www.newrules.org/retail/news_slug.php?slugid=308" rel="nofollow">Response to Wal-Mart's New "Green" Store in McKinney, Texas - Institute for Local Self-Reliance<p>
You can find much more on the impacts of big-box developments at our <a href="http://www.newrules.org/retail/" rel="nofollow">Hometown Advantage web site

<p>John Bailey
<a href="http://www.newrules.org/" rel="nofollow">http://www.newrules.org/</a></p></a></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by jdhlax</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2005 11:43:09 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>Oxymoron Is Correct!</strong></p><p>I'm with John on this one. &nbsp;Saying that Walmart "is, for good or ill, here [to stay]" is defeatist. &nbsp;I'm sure that's exactly what Walmart wants people to say and think. &nbsp;The fact is that unsustainable things like Walmart will be gone long before sustainable ones.</p>
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				<p><strong>Oxymoron Is Correct!</strong></p><p>I'm with John on this one. &nbsp;Saying that Walmart "is, for good or ill, here [to stay]" is defeatist. &nbsp;I'm sure that's exactly what Walmart wants people to say and think. &nbsp;The fact is that unsustainable things like Walmart will be gone long before sustainable ones.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by robustgreen</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2005 11:44:52 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Wall Mart Greening</strong></p><p>I think that we need to accentuate the positive.<br>
Give them Kudos for making a commitment to move in the right direction and encourage them to make more steps like focusing on organic produce, buying locally grown foods whenever possible and eliminating GMO foods. <br>
Of course the whole wage issue is another front, but we need to separate these two issues and reward the positive..</br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>Wall Mart Greening</strong></p><p>I think that we need to accentuate the positive.<br>
Give them Kudos for making a commitment to move in the right direction and encourage them to make more steps like focusing on organic produce, buying locally grown foods whenever possible and eliminating GMO foods. <br>
Of course the whole wage issue is another front, but we need to separate these two issues and reward the positive..</br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by peas2you</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2005 05:32:58 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>&quot;clap, clap, clap, clap!&quot;</strong></p><p>Way to go, &nbsp;Walmart. &nbsp;If there is organic fiber clothing in a Walmart, or some blend, I will be more likely to purchase a tshirt or whatever that I can SEE and TRY ON than one on-line that I can't try on. If I can find organic milk (we hope it's organic) at Walmart at less than $5 a gallon, I would be thrilled! Because then I could switch to it. &nbsp;</p><p>
Walmart appears to serve the masses. What better than to get organically grown products in front of the eyes of the masses? Currently in my town, there are only a couple of organic grocers and they are far from where I live. I myself am &nbsp;more likely to purchase organically grown foods if they are easily found. </p><p>
Currently, I don't buy groceries at Walmart. They carry zero, zilch products that are organically grown or some combination thereof. I looked there recently. At least at my preferred grocery store (because it's at most 100ft from my house), I can find some organic products that I like, though certainly not all. </p><p>
ANY movement towards environmentally sound practices and purchases should be ENCOURAGED. </p><p>
Isn't that what we hope for on an individual basis? It's not "all environmentally sound" or nothing with ourselves, is it? &nbsp;</p><p>
Remember those ads by the Latter Day Saints? The kid brings home a good report card, and the parent just points out what's wrong with the kid/grades instead of praising the good? </p><p>
I am curious to see what types of products they carry, and to "praise" Walmart, I'll probably purchase some of them. </p>
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				<p><strong>&quot;clap, clap, clap, clap!&quot;</strong></p><p>Way to go, &nbsp;Walmart. &nbsp;If there is organic fiber clothing in a Walmart, or some blend, I will be more likely to purchase a tshirt or whatever that I can SEE and TRY ON than one on-line that I can't try on. If I can find organic milk (we hope it's organic) at Walmart at less than $5 a gallon, I would be thrilled! Because then I could switch to it. &nbsp;</p><p>
Walmart appears to serve the masses. What better than to get organically grown products in front of the eyes of the masses? Currently in my town, there are only a couple of organic grocers and they are far from where I live. I myself am &nbsp;more likely to purchase organically grown foods if they are easily found. </p><p>
Currently, I don't buy groceries at Walmart. They carry zero, zilch products that are organically grown or some combination thereof. I looked there recently. At least at my preferred grocery store (because it's at most 100ft from my house), I can find some organic products that I like, though certainly not all. </p><p>
ANY movement towards environmentally sound practices and purchases should be ENCOURAGED. </p><p>
Isn't that what we hope for on an individual basis? It's not "all environmentally sound" or nothing with ourselves, is it? &nbsp;</p><p>
Remember those ads by the Latter Day Saints? The kid brings home a good report card, and the parent just points out what's wrong with the kid/grades instead of praising the good? </p><p>
I am curious to see what types of products they carry, and to "praise" Walmart, I'll probably purchase some of them. </p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by cmdlvmt</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2005 07:24:25 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>Wal-Mart goes (?) green</strong></p><p>Yeah, right! Make it look like the mega-company actually CARES about our environment; all the while paying its American workers as close to the now non-living, substandard minimum wage as possible; shipping all its manufacturing to third-world countries where they can pay their workers even SMALLER substandard, non-living wages, then entice all us low-income poor people to shop for low prices so we can continue to not only be poor, but also to support such substandard wages for the rest of the world's poor people! &nbsp;If the company truly cared about the Earth and its working population, they would PAY living wages and be much less greedy for their humongous lions' share of the massive profits. Gee, you think they might think of something so responsible as marketing Fair Trade goods, or the American-made merchandise their ads used to brag about?

<p>Crazy Cat Lady</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Wal-Mart goes (?) green</strong></p><p>Yeah, right! Make it look like the mega-company actually CARES about our environment; all the while paying its American workers as close to the now non-living, substandard minimum wage as possible; shipping all its manufacturing to third-world countries where they can pay their workers even SMALLER substandard, non-living wages, then entice all us low-income poor people to shop for low prices so we can continue to not only be poor, but also to support such substandard wages for the rest of the world's poor people! &nbsp;If the company truly cared about the Earth and its working population, they would PAY living wages and be much less greedy for their humongous lions' share of the massive profits. Gee, you think they might think of something so responsible as marketing Fair Trade goods, or the American-made merchandise their ads used to brag about?

<p>Crazy Cat Lady</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by jfranke</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2005 07:33:01 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>I don't buy it...literally and figuratively</strong></p><p>I have several questions: </p><p>
Will Walmart hire an indipendent watchdog to go see how their goods are being manufactured in China? I would wager that the answer is no. Having spent a good deal of time in China, I can tell &nbsp;you that the country is a social and environmental hellhole, and so incredibly corrupt as to make the U.S., even under the Bush junta, seem like paradise. My suspicion is that that Walmart's new campaign is a cheap ploy to deflect the slowly growing suspicion that Walmart is ultimately bad for local economies, which they'd like to greenwash with their growing reputation as community-wrecking behemoth by slapping on some superficial, toothless greenie rhetoric. </p><p>
I also find it sad that people fall for this stuff so readily. The lack of critical thinking displayed by people who think of themselves as environmentally conscious is representative of how powerless we've become - we get a little peck on the cheek and think it's a proposal for marriage.<br>
</br></p>
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				<p><strong>I don't buy it...literally and figuratively</strong></p><p>I have several questions: </p><p>
Will Walmart hire an indipendent watchdog to go see how their goods are being manufactured in China? I would wager that the answer is no. Having spent a good deal of time in China, I can tell &nbsp;you that the country is a social and environmental hellhole, and so incredibly corrupt as to make the U.S., even under the Bush junta, seem like paradise. My suspicion is that that Walmart's new campaign is a cheap ploy to deflect the slowly growing suspicion that Walmart is ultimately bad for local economies, which they'd like to greenwash with their growing reputation as community-wrecking behemoth by slapping on some superficial, toothless greenie rhetoric. </p><p>
I also find it sad that people fall for this stuff so readily. The lack of critical thinking displayed by people who think of themselves as environmentally conscious is representative of how powerless we've become - we get a little peck on the cheek and think it's a proposal for marriage.<br>
</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by sukumar</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2005 16:17:41 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>No company CARES about the environment</strong></p><p>...not even those sponsoring slick ads on National Geographic. Companies exist to earn profits for their owners/shareholders by selling their products. The recent makeover by Walmart reflects their awareness as to how their image could be affecting their bottom line, as well as changing realities and public consciousness that require even a company like Walmart to pay lip service to environmental concerns today. As to how far they will go in the direction of genuine green transformation or whether they will be able to get off with mere lip service and window dressing, and whether we will be able to hold their feet to the fire on other issues such as their wage and hiring policies, these depend more on us consumers than on some (ha!) "benign" executive.</p>
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				<p><strong>No company CARES about the environment</strong></p><p>...not even those sponsoring slick ads on National Geographic. Companies exist to earn profits for their owners/shareholders by selling their products. The recent makeover by Walmart reflects their awareness as to how their image could be affecting their bottom line, as well as changing realities and public consciousness that require even a company like Walmart to pay lip service to environmental concerns today. As to how far they will go in the direction of genuine green transformation or whether they will be able to get off with mere lip service and window dressing, and whether we will be able to hold their feet to the fire on other issues such as their wage and hiring policies, these depend more on us consumers than on some (ha!) "benign" executive.</p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by jungle lotus</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2005 19:01:08 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>Wal-Mart Wants To Cut Employee Benefits<p>I think that <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/business/26walmart.ready.html?pagewanted=1&amp;ei=5088&amp;en=e9a0f5d466bb026e&amp;ex=1287979200&amp;partner=rssnyt&amp;emc=rss" rel="nofollow">this New York Times piece helps shed some light on the new, kindler, gentler Wal-Mart.<br>
</br></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Wal-Mart Wants To Cut Employee Benefits<p>I think that <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/business/26walmart.ready.html?pagewanted=1&amp;ei=5088&amp;en=e9a0f5d466bb026e&amp;ex=1287979200&amp;partner=rssnyt&amp;emc=rss" rel="nofollow">this New York Times piece helps shed some light on the new, kindler, gentler Wal-Mart.<br>
</br></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by jfranke</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 26 Oct 2005 11:59:35 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/wal-mart/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>Exactly</strong></p><p>There you have it - these people can't even keep their reputations greenwashed for a week before their interest in profit uber alles becomes completely apparent once again. If they can't find it in their black little hearts to take care of their employees here in the States, does anybody honestly believe that they give a damn about working conditions in China? </p><p>
I'm sorry, but you really can't shine a turd.<br>
</br></p>
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				<p><strong>Exactly</strong></p><p>There you have it - these people can't even keep their reputations greenwashed for a week before their interest in profit uber alles becomes completely apparent once again. If they can't find it in their black little hearts to take care of their employees here in the States, does anybody honestly believe that they give a damn about working conditions in China? </p><p>
I'm sorry, but you really can't shine a turd.<br>
</br></p>
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