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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for &#8216;Volcanoes emit more CO2 than humans&#8217;&#8212;Not even close ...]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Schoneveld</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:11:38 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Putting up a straw man<p>I have never heard a skeptic making that ridiculous claim. It seems you are putting up a straw man in order to be able to kick it. The skeptics are not that dumb. They do come up with some reasonable objections to the AGW hypothesis. It is not all rubbish what they say, nor always with bad intentions or hidden agenda's. If someone can be expected to have an agenda then it is an American politician who thinks that this will lead him into the White House. The simplistic reasoning and applied demagogy of Al Gore (in fact, he makes himself a straw man) give the skeptics an easy target to attack. Al Gore's movie can hardly be qualified as being properly peer reviewed. I am flabbergasted by the gullibility of the otherwise critical environmental groups for embracing this politician so uncritically. I wouldn't want &nbsp;him to pull my bandwagon.<p>
Talking about CO2. How come that the Southern Polar Monthly Mean Temperature Anomalies show a cooling trend for the last 27 years, yet the Antarctic is believed to be melting. There is certainly no relationship with the gradually increasing CO2 concentrations. See this graph.<p>
<a href="http://www.junkscience.com/MSU_Temps/UAHMSUSPol-m.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.junkscience.com/MSU_Temps/UAHMSUSPol-m.htm<p>
Is there anybody who can help me interpreting these conflicting data?<br>
</br></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Putting up a straw man<p>I have never heard a skeptic making that ridiculous claim. It seems you are putting up a straw man in order to be able to kick it. The skeptics are not that dumb. They do come up with some reasonable objections to the AGW hypothesis. It is not all rubbish what they say, nor always with bad intentions or hidden agenda's. If someone can be expected to have an agenda then it is an American politician who thinks that this will lead him into the White House. The simplistic reasoning and applied demagogy of Al Gore (in fact, he makes himself a straw man) give the skeptics an easy target to attack. Al Gore's movie can hardly be qualified as being properly peer reviewed. I am flabbergasted by the gullibility of the otherwise critical environmental groups for embracing this politician so uncritically. I wouldn't want &nbsp;him to pull my bandwagon.<p>
Talking about CO2. How come that the Southern Polar Monthly Mean Temperature Anomalies show a cooling trend for the last 27 years, yet the Antarctic is believed to be melting. There is certainly no relationship with the gradually increasing CO2 concentrations. See this graph.<p>
<a href="http://www.junkscience.com/MSU_Temps/UAHMSUSPol-m.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.junkscience.com/MSU_Temps/UAHMSUSPol-m.htm<p>
Is there anybody who can help me interpreting these conflicting data?<br>
</br></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Coby Beck</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:30:09 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>you need to talk to more &quot;skeptics&quot;<p>This volcano argument is used all the time, try google if you don't believe me.<br>
<a href="http://www.google.com/search?&amp;q=volcanoes+%22more+CO2%22+%22global+warming%22" rel="nofollow">http://www.google.com/search?&amp;q=volcanoes+%22more+CO2...<p>
I'm top of the list, but I am there or near it for many common arguments, like Global Warming is a hoax. &nbsp;Sadly, that is no strawman either.<p>
There are indeed better attacks than this, but I have one article per attack, what do you want? 

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>you need to talk to more &quot;skeptics&quot;<p>This volcano argument is used all the time, try google if you don't believe me.<br>
<a href="http://www.google.com/search?&amp;q=volcanoes+%22more+CO2%22+%22global+warming%22" rel="nofollow">http://www.google.com/search?&amp;q=volcanoes+%22more+CO2...<p>
I'm top of the list, but I am there or near it for many common arguments, like Global Warming is a hoax. &nbsp;Sadly, that is no strawman either.<p>
There are indeed better attacks than this, but I have one article per attack, what do you want? 

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by Coby Beck</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:33:53 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>Antarctica is not cooling<p>Actually the latest results show a very modest warming, but regardless the trend there is very small. &nbsp;You can read this related article for some explanation:<br>
<a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2006/11/19/213716/27" rel="nofollow">http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2006/11/19/213716/27<p>
It has to do with the much greater ocean to land ratio in the southern hemisphere and the circumpolar current insulating antarctica.<p>
Personally, given how many times the MSU records have been revised I would be very cautious in drawing conclusions based on them. &nbsp;Call me sceptical!

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Antarctica is not cooling<p>Actually the latest results show a very modest warming, but regardless the trend there is very small. &nbsp;You can read this related article for some explanation:<br>
<a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2006/11/19/213716/27" rel="nofollow">http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2006/11/19/213716/27<p>
It has to do with the much greater ocean to land ratio in the southern hemisphere and the circumpolar current insulating antarctica.<p>
Personally, given how many times the MSU records have been revised I would be very cautious in drawing conclusions based on them. &nbsp;Call me sceptical!

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by Schoneveld</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 19:33:21 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>A skeptic scientist</strong></p><p>Of course, by googling you can find any crazy blog or right wing nut who makes unscientific claims. When we try to debunk arguments put forward by skeptics then I mean "scientists" from the skeptics camp. Like Bob Carter, Lindzen, Gray, McIntyre and name another 100 Profs and Dr's in geology, climatology etc.</p>
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				<p><strong>A skeptic scientist</strong></p><p>Of course, by googling you can find any crazy blog or right wing nut who makes unscientific claims. When we try to debunk arguments put forward by skeptics then I mean "scientists" from the skeptics camp. Like Bob Carter, Lindzen, Gray, McIntyre and name another 100 Profs and Dr's in geology, climatology etc.</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by Coby Beck</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2006 03:53:44 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>don' over estimate these folks</strong></p><p>Do you consider "global warming is a hoax" to be unscientific? &nbsp;How about "global warming stopped in 1998", is that a ludicrous argument for a scientist? &nbsp;Both of those come from people in your list, so don't be so quick to say stupid arguments should not be answered, these are high profile people and they do need to be answered.</p><p>
You'll have to take my word for it, I hear this volcano argument all the time and naive but well meaning people are susceptible to it.

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p>
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				<p><strong>don' over estimate these folks</strong></p><p>Do you consider "global warming is a hoax" to be unscientific? &nbsp;How about "global warming stopped in 1998", is that a ludicrous argument for a scientist? &nbsp;Both of those come from people in your list, so don't be so quick to say stupid arguments should not be answered, these are high profile people and they do need to be answered.</p><p>
You'll have to take my word for it, I hear this volcano argument all the time and naive but well meaning people are susceptible to it.

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by caniscandida</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2006 04:40:47 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>vulcanism and the K/T die-off?</strong></p><p>As everybody knows, around 64 million years ago, the Cretaceous Period and the Mesozoic Era came to a close with a remarkable mass extinction. &nbsp;Many taxa, including most famously the last of the non-avian dinosaurs, disappeared, in a rather sudden way, according to the fossil record. &nbsp;In the last 30 years, a consensus has emerged that the collision of a large meteoritic object, probably a small asteroid, with the Earth, apparently at the northern end of the Yucatan peninsula, sent up so much particulate matter into the atmosphere, that it caused a severe global cooling for many years, killing off both plants and then animals.</p><p>
Those scientists who initially rejected that hypothesis, preferring to look for a cause of the extinction based firmly on Earth, pointed out the apparently uncontroversial huge volcanic event that took place around that time in the Deccan region of India. &nbsp;But the idea there too was that a great amount of particulate matter ejected into the atmosphere would have caused a severe global cooling.</p><p>
I ask, therefore, if the effect of volcanic eruptions on climate is at all a simple thing to measure. &nbsp;Is not the effect of any GHGs emitted offset by the ejection of darkening and cooling particulate matter?

<p>Chickens are our cousins!
So are other sensitive animals!
Enough is enough!
No more factory farms!</p></p>
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				<p><strong>vulcanism and the K/T die-off?</strong></p><p>As everybody knows, around 64 million years ago, the Cretaceous Period and the Mesozoic Era came to a close with a remarkable mass extinction. &nbsp;Many taxa, including most famously the last of the non-avian dinosaurs, disappeared, in a rather sudden way, according to the fossil record. &nbsp;In the last 30 years, a consensus has emerged that the collision of a large meteoritic object, probably a small asteroid, with the Earth, apparently at the northern end of the Yucatan peninsula, sent up so much particulate matter into the atmosphere, that it caused a severe global cooling for many years, killing off both plants and then animals.</p><p>
Those scientists who initially rejected that hypothesis, preferring to look for a cause of the extinction based firmly on Earth, pointed out the apparently uncontroversial huge volcanic event that took place around that time in the Deccan region of India. &nbsp;But the idea there too was that a great amount of particulate matter ejected into the atmosphere would have caused a severe global cooling.</p><p>
I ask, therefore, if the effect of volcanic eruptions on climate is at all a simple thing to measure. &nbsp;Is not the effect of any GHGs emitted offset by the ejection of darkening and cooling particulate matter?

<p>Chickens are our cousins!
So are other sensitive animals!
Enough is enough!
No more factory farms!</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by Schoneveld</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2006 11:54:20 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>References?</strong></p><p>Could you give me the reference so that I can check whether they indeed used silly arguments like that? I have never heard any scientist denying that the gradual rise in CO2 is not man -made. The argument has &nbsp;always been that there is a logarithmic relationship rather than a linear one so that further CO2 increase has progressively less effect on warming the atmosphere.</p>
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				<p><strong>References?</strong></p><p>Could you give me the reference so that I can check whether they indeed used silly arguments like that? I have never heard any scientist denying that the gradual rise in CO2 is not man -made. The argument has &nbsp;always been that there is a logarithmic relationship rather than a linear one so that further CO2 increase has progressively less effect on warming the atmosphere.</p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Coby Beck</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 22 Dec 2006 10:11:31 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>here you go<p>"They've been brainwashing us for 20 years," Gray says. "Starting with the nuclear winter and now with the global warming. This scare will also run its course. In 15-20 years, we'll look back and see what a hoax this was." <br>
<a href="http://www.denverpost.com/harsanyi/ci_3899807" rel="nofollow">http://www.denverpost.com/harsanyi/ci_3899807<p>
"The...<p>
Lindzen on the temperature record: "remaining essentially flat since 1998."<br>
<a href="http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110008597" rel="nofollow">http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110008597<p>
I don't know specifically about scientist sceptics claiming the CO2 rise is not anthropogenic.

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></a></br></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>here you go<p>"They've been brainwashing us for 20 years," Gray says. "Starting with the nuclear winter and now with the global warming. This scare will also run its course. In 15-20 years, we'll look back and see what a hoax this was." <br>
<a href="http://www.denverpost.com/harsanyi/ci_3899807" rel="nofollow">http://www.denverpost.com/harsanyi/ci_3899807<p>
"The...<p>
Lindzen on the temperature record: "remaining essentially flat since 1998."<br>
<a href="http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110008597" rel="nofollow">http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110008597<p>
I don't know specifically about scientist sceptics claiming the CO2 rise is not anthropogenic.

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></p></a></br></p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by Coby Beck</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 22 Dec 2006 10:13:46 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>glitch..?<p>Don't know what happened to the second quote, will try again:<p>
"There IS a problem with global warming... it stopped in 1998"<br>
<a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2006/04/09/do0907.xml" rel="nofollow">http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinio...

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>glitch..?<p>Don't know what happened to the second quote, will try again:<p>
"There IS a problem with global warming... it stopped in 1998"<br>
<a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2006/04/09/do0907.xml" rel="nofollow">http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinio...

<p>Invent a clever saying, and your name will live forever!

-- Anonymous</p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by mpu2</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 17 Apr 2007 00:12:52 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/10</guid>
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            <title>Comment #11 by stevendaryl3016</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 25 Apr 2007 05:27:44 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/11</guid>
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				<p><strong>Just an example: Walter E. Williams<p>The misinformation about volcanoes and CO2 has been spread in a recent opinion piece by Walter E. Williams. You can read the article <a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2007/03/28/global_warming_heresy" rel="nofollow">here.</a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Just an example: Walter E. Williams<p>The misinformation about volcanoes and CO2 has been spread in a recent opinion piece by Walter E. Williams. You can read the article <a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2007/03/28/global_warming_heresy" rel="nofollow">here.</a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by blutack</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 07:32:36 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/12</guid>
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				<p><strong>I've heard it</strong></p><p>"I have never heard a skeptic making that ridiculous claim. It seems you are putting up a straw man in order to be able to kick it. The skeptics are not that dumb."</p><p>
I have a friend who presented me with this argument recently - he claimed one volcano will emit more CO2 than humans ever have. </p><p>
Unfortunately neither of us are scientists, and I could not contest his point as I had no idea what the CO2 output of volcanoes versus that of fossil fuel burning was. Isn't the point of this website for people discussing the issue with ANY skeptic, not just scientists (it would be rather pointless if it was just for scientists, as the vast majority don't need convincing)?</p><p>
My point is my friend must have heard it from somewhere...people do come out with it.</p>
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				<p><strong>I've heard it</strong></p><p>"I have never heard a skeptic making that ridiculous claim. It seems you are putting up a straw man in order to be able to kick it. The skeptics are not that dumb."</p><p>
I have a friend who presented me with this argument recently - he claimed one volcano will emit more CO2 than humans ever have. </p><p>
Unfortunately neither of us are scientists, and I could not contest his point as I had no idea what the CO2 output of volcanoes versus that of fossil fuel burning was. Isn't the point of this website for people discussing the issue with ANY skeptic, not just scientists (it would be rather pointless if it was just for scientists, as the vast majority don't need convincing)?</p><p>
My point is my friend must have heard it from somewhere...people do come out with it.</p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 07:37:46 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/13</guid>
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				<p><strong>12 samples?<p><br>
That's all the sampling stations there are?<p>
Well, you just proved the skeptics point, possibly.<p>
Volcanoes cannot be "averaged". &nbsp; They are catastropic emitters of CO2. &nbsp; A single wild volcano can put tonnes of CO2 into the air.<p>
Having monitoring stations that average it is not adequate.<p>
And that does not at all measure any of the greenhouse gases, including CO2, that are constantly emitted from the Earth's crust.<p>
We're no where near measuring CO2 from naturogenic sources.<p>
What's more -- now that I think about it -- perhaps we have no idea what the real anthrogenic amount is.<p>
I mean, you show CO2 going up and up -- God only knows where it comes from! &nbsp; Obviously you don't know how much is coming from nature.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>12 samples?<p><br>
That's all the sampling stations there are?<p>
Well, you just proved the skeptics point, possibly.<p>
Volcanoes cannot be "averaged". &nbsp; They are catastropic emitters of CO2. &nbsp; A single wild volcano can put tonnes of CO2 into the air.<p>
Having monitoring stations that average it is not adequate.<p>
And that does not at all measure any of the greenhouse gases, including CO2, that are constantly emitted from the Earth's crust.<p>
We're no where near measuring CO2 from naturogenic sources.<p>
What's more -- now that I think about it -- perhaps we have no idea what the real anthrogenic amount is.<p>
I mean, you show CO2 going up and up -- God only knows where it comes from! &nbsp; Obviously you don't know how much is coming from nature.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #14 by blutack</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 08:10:19 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/14</guid>
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				<p><strong>Hmm</strong></p><p>Like I said, I'm no scientist, but I'm not stupid either.</p><p>
If CO2 is coming from nature (which no one is disputing, it has always done - only in the carbon cycle as much gets re-absorbed too) and the earth's crust and is causing this sudden and rapid rise, why is it that it has only suddenly shot up at the very same time we began to burn fossil fuels??</p>
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				<p><strong>Hmm</strong></p><p>Like I said, I'm no scientist, but I'm not stupid either.</p><p>
If CO2 is coming from nature (which no one is disputing, it has always done - only in the carbon cycle as much gets re-absorbed too) and the earth's crust and is causing this sudden and rapid rise, why is it that it has only suddenly shot up at the very same time we began to burn fossil fuels??</p>
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            <title>Comment #15 by GreyFlcn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 09:45:30 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/15</guid>
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				<p><strong>Yeap<p>The real answer, without getting terribly scientific about it.<p>
CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
And the growth in CO2 emmisions correlates perfectly with our fossil fuel emmisions.<p>
But hell, how about this one.<br>
Even the guy who produced "The Great Global Warming Swindle" agrees that the rise in CO2 has been caused by industry.<br>
<a href="http://youtube.com/watch?v=rtNdVDom0GU" rel="nofollow">http://youtube.com/watch?v=rtNdVDom0GU</a></br></br></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Yeap<p>The real answer, without getting terribly scientific about it.<p>
CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
And the growth in CO2 emmisions correlates perfectly with our fossil fuel emmisions.<p>
But hell, how about this one.<br>
Even the guy who produced "The Great Global Warming Swindle" agrees that the rise in CO2 has been caused by industry.<br>
<a href="http://youtube.com/watch?v=rtNdVDom0GU" rel="nofollow">http://youtube.com/watch?v=rtNdVDom0GU</a></br></br></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #16 by cce</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 12:32:58 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/16</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>Measurements</strong></p><p>We can measure how much CO2 is caused by burning fossil fuels by measuring the ratio of carbon isotopes which are different for naturally occuring CO2.</p><p>
We know the expected range of CO2 in the atmosphere by studying the ice cores. &nbsp;On short time scales, the level is kept more or less constant through the carbon cycle. &nbsp;Burning fossil fuels short circuits this process.</p><p>
The "volcanoes emit more CO2 than mankind" is such a preposterous statement and is demonstrably false. &nbsp;Mount Pinatubo, certainly the most powerful eruption of the modern era doesn't even register a blip in the Manua Loa measurements. &nbsp;In reality, all the volcanic activity in the world amounts to about 1% of human activity.</p><p>
With regards to the cooling effect of volcanoes, that is true and large eruptions can cause significant disruptions in the climate (as we saw with Pinatubo). &nbsp;However, these particles quickly rain out of the atmosphere. &nbsp;CO2 takes many centuries to completely leave the atmosphere.</p>
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				<p><strong>Measurements</strong></p><p>We can measure how much CO2 is caused by burning fossil fuels by measuring the ratio of carbon isotopes which are different for naturally occuring CO2.</p><p>
We know the expected range of CO2 in the atmosphere by studying the ice cores. &nbsp;On short time scales, the level is kept more or less constant through the carbon cycle. &nbsp;Burning fossil fuels short circuits this process.</p><p>
The "volcanoes emit more CO2 than mankind" is such a preposterous statement and is demonstrably false. &nbsp;Mount Pinatubo, certainly the most powerful eruption of the modern era doesn't even register a blip in the Manua Loa measurements. &nbsp;In reality, all the volcanic activity in the world amounts to about 1% of human activity.</p><p>
With regards to the cooling effect of volcanoes, that is true and large eruptions can cause significant disruptions in the climate (as we saw with Pinatubo). &nbsp;However, these particles quickly rain out of the atmosphere. &nbsp;CO2 takes many centuries to completely leave the atmosphere.</p>
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            <title>Comment #17 by GreyFlcn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 15:37:04 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/17</guid>
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				<p><strong>Lemme say that again:<p>The real answer, without getting terribly scientific about it.<p>
CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
And there have been countless volcanic erruptions during that time period.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
And that relatively sudden growth in CO2 levels fits perfectly with our growth in fossil fuel use.<p>
_<p>
<strong>Without erruptions Volcanoes emit less than 2% of human emmisions of CO2. <p>
_<p>
<strong>With erruptions volcanoes do emit a lot of CO2<p>
But they also emit a lots of airborne dust (scientifically known as "aerosols")<p>
And Aerosols are the primary cooling factor, particularly Sulfur aerosols.<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing3.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing3.png<p>
And while it cools the surface, and troposphere (greenhouse layer), it's very noticable about how it warms the stratosphere (ozone layer) as the sulfur turns into sufuric acid.<p>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing.png<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing2.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing2.png</a></br></a></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p></p></strong></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Lemme say that again:<p>The real answer, without getting terribly scientific about it.<p>
CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
And there have been countless volcanic erruptions during that time period.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
And that relatively sudden growth in CO2 levels fits perfectly with our growth in fossil fuel use.<p>
_<p>
<strong>Without erruptions Volcanoes emit less than 2% of human emmisions of CO2. <p>
_<p>
<strong>With erruptions volcanoes do emit a lot of CO2<p>
But they also emit a lots of airborne dust (scientifically known as "aerosols")<p>
And Aerosols are the primary cooling factor, particularly Sulfur aerosols.<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing3.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing3.png<p>
And while it cools the surface, and troposphere (greenhouse layer), it's very noticable about how it warms the stratosphere (ozone layer) as the sulfur turns into sufuric acid.<p>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing.png<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing2.png" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/forcing2.png</a></br></a></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p></p></strong></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #18 by Zarkov</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 16:18:49 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/18</guid>
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				<p><strong>FIRE</strong></p><p>LOL</p><p>
What a joke</p><p>
Y'all worried about CO2</p><p>
Better put out all those mega forest fires..</p><p>
No, better still, cut down all the forests NOW, we can afford for them to burn.</p><p>
LOL</p><p>
This world has burnt several times in the past</p><p>
CO2 is NOT THE PROBLEM</p><p>
omegafour.com</p>
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				<p><strong>FIRE</strong></p><p>LOL</p><p>
What a joke</p><p>
Y'all worried about CO2</p><p>
Better put out all those mega forest fires..</p><p>
No, better still, cut down all the forests NOW, we can afford for them to burn.</p><p>
LOL</p><p>
This world has burnt several times in the past</p><p>
CO2 is NOT THE PROBLEM</p><p>
omegafour.com</p>
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            <title>Comment #19 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 08:14:10 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/19</guid>
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				<p><strong>Oh, Pleeeeze<p>And the growth in CO2 emmisions correlates perfectly with our fossil fuel emmisions.<p>
Really? &nbsp;Do you have a CO2 meter on each and every human "activity"?<p>
What is the state of actual anthropogenic CO2 monitoring?<p>
It sounds like all guestimates to me -- that is, the IPCC says oh, Co2 went up so it must be due to people, so people cause global warming...there is no effort to show where the Co2 came from?!<br>


<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></br></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Oh, Pleeeeze<p>And the growth in CO2 emmisions correlates perfectly with our fossil fuel emmisions.<p>
Really? &nbsp;Do you have a CO2 meter on each and every human "activity"?<p>
What is the state of actual anthropogenic CO2 monitoring?<p>
It sounds like all guestimates to me -- that is, the IPCC says oh, Co2 went up so it must be due to people, so people cause global warming...there is no effort to show where the Co2 came from?!<br>


<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></br></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #20 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 08:20:13 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/20</guid>
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				<p><strong>If I Don't Turn the Ignition Key...<p>Without erruptions Volcanoes emit less than 2% of human emmisions of CO2. <br>
&nbsp;_<br>
With erruptions volcanoes do emit a lot of CO2<p>
Yes, and if I leave my car in the parking space and don't turn the ignition, it produces significantly less CO2.<p>
That was my point about monitoring...a single active volcano is not the same as 12 meters at 12 not so active volcanoes.<p>
In other words, you have no idea how much CO2 is being pumped into the atmosphere by nature...no idea whatsoever!<p>
This is an absolute travesty. &nbsp; Why didn't I think of this before!<br>


<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></br></p></p></p></p></br></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>If I Don't Turn the Ignition Key...<p>Without erruptions Volcanoes emit less than 2% of human emmisions of CO2. <br>
&nbsp;_<br>
With erruptions volcanoes do emit a lot of CO2<p>
Yes, and if I leave my car in the parking space and don't turn the ignition, it produces significantly less CO2.<p>
That was my point about monitoring...a single active volcano is not the same as 12 meters at 12 not so active volcanoes.<p>
In other words, you have no idea how much CO2 is being pumped into the atmosphere by nature...no idea whatsoever!<p>
This is an absolute travesty. &nbsp; Why didn't I think of this before!<br>


<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></br></p></p></p></p></br></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #21 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 16:03:43 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/21</guid>
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				<p><strong>Volcanoes not only source of CO2<p><br>
Obviously vocanoes emit enormous amounts of CO2 but are not the only sources.<p>
Outgassing from the earth's crust is among many.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Volcanoes not only source of CO2<p><br>
Obviously vocanoes emit enormous amounts of CO2 but are not the only sources.<p>
Outgassing from the earth's crust is among many.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #22 by GreyFlcn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 16:52:02 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/22</guid>
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				<p><strong>Again<p>CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
And there have been countless volcanic erruptions during that time period.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
Volcanoes aren't all the sudden causing this.<p>
_<p>
Even Martin Durkin, the producer of the "Global Warming Swindle" admits the rise in CO2 has been caused by industry.<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/carbon" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/carbon</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Again<p>CO2 levels have never gone above 281 parts per million in 650,000 years of ice core data.<p>
And there have been countless volcanic erruptions during that time period.<p>
We're now at 380 parts per million<p>
Volcanoes aren't all the sudden causing this.<p>
_<p>
Even Martin Durkin, the producer of the "Global Warming Swindle" admits the rise in CO2 has been caused by industry.<br>
<a href="http://www.greyfalcon.net/carbon" rel="nofollow">http://www.greyfalcon.net/carbon</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #23 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:08:12 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/23</guid>
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				<p><strong>Again...again<p><br>
Yes, but you can't prove that it's man causing it all either.<p>
You don't have the data.<p>
And even if you did, you still haven't proven that CO2 is a cause and not a result of warming.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Again...again<p><br>
Yes, but you can't prove that it's man causing it all either.<p>
You don't have the data.<p>
And even if you did, you still haven't proven that CO2 is a cause and not a result of warming.

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #24 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:20:47 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/24</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>Chart Junk<p>Btw...a lot of these charts are definitely chart junk. &nbsp; Case in point...lopping off axes to over emphasis change.<p>
For example, the source of your chart seems to be wikipedia....I'm looking at <p>
<a href="http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/Image:Carbon_History_and_Flux_Rev_png#Fossil_fuel_carbon_flux" rel="nofollow">http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/Image:Carbon_History ...<p>
Note that the Y-axis only shows 260 to 380.<p>
Here's an experiment I did -- I replotted the data using OpenOffice Calc into a spreadsheet chart that has as it's y-axis baseline, 0.<p>
Then you get an idea how undramatic the change in number is!!!

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Chart Junk<p>Btw...a lot of these charts are definitely chart junk. &nbsp; Case in point...lopping off axes to over emphasis change.<p>
For example, the source of your chart seems to be wikipedia....I'm looking at <p>
<a href="http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/Image:Carbon_History_and_Flux_Rev_png#Fossil_fuel_carbon_flux" rel="nofollow">http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/Image:Carbon_History ...<p>
Note that the Y-axis only shows 260 to 380.<p>
Here's an experiment I did -- I replotted the data using OpenOffice Calc into a spreadsheet chart that has as it's y-axis baseline, 0.<p>
Then you get an idea how undramatic the change in number is!!!

<p><a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></p></p></p></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #25 by jult</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 07:48:59 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/25</guid>
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				<p><strong>disaster prediction</strong></p><p>The reason this is mentioned has been somewhat twisted from its original source, which is:</p><p>
If a <strong>supervulcano</strong> might erupt in the near future (which is actually not such a remote possibility), its CO2 output will vastly overrule any other source.</p><p>
This was how this came about. Because it was used in combination with the other optional disasters awaiting humanity, where CO2 emissions still play a very minor role in causing any of them to happen.</p>
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				<p><strong>disaster prediction</strong></p><p>The reason this is mentioned has been somewhat twisted from its original source, which is:</p><p>
If a <strong>supervulcano</strong> might erupt in the near future (which is actually not such a remote possibility), its CO2 output will vastly overrule any other source.</p><p>
This was how this came about. Because it was used in combination with the other optional disasters awaiting humanity, where CO2 emissions still play a very minor role in causing any of them to happen.</p>
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            <title>Comment #26 by Higmo</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jul 2007 01:46:49 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/26</guid>
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				<p><strong>conflicting data</strong></p><p>Loved your comment..it appears the sun is undergoing some unusual activity that is effecting not only the earth..but at virtually the same rate..the mars polar caps are shrinking and is suffering some extreme dust storms...hmmm..think there may just be some correlation? Plus I seriously doubt our emissions have contributed to Mars global warming and why doesn't science pay more attention to historical references to cyclical warming and cooling as so eleoquently noted by Plato, Aristotle; and the Vikings inhabiting then abandoning Greenland as it went from a fairly temperate climate to an almost uninhabitable one?</p>
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				<p><strong>conflicting data</strong></p><p>Loved your comment..it appears the sun is undergoing some unusual activity that is effecting not only the earth..but at virtually the same rate..the mars polar caps are shrinking and is suffering some extreme dust storms...hmmm..think there may just be some correlation? Plus I seriously doubt our emissions have contributed to Mars global warming and why doesn't science pay more attention to historical references to cyclical warming and cooling as so eleoquently noted by Plato, Aristotle; and the Vikings inhabiting then abandoning Greenland as it went from a fairly temperate climate to an almost uninhabitable one?</p>
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            <title>Comment #27 by clarinetmeister</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:02:30 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/27</guid>
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				<p><strong>Putting up a &quot;straw man&quot;?</strong></p><p>The volcano argument, believe it or not, is used in many Internet forum arguments by many heavily misinformed people. It stuns me that they would indeed fall for this particular argument, however.</p>
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				<p><strong>Putting up a &quot;straw man&quot;?</strong></p><p>The volcano argument, believe it or not, is used in many Internet forum arguments by many heavily misinformed people. It stuns me that they would indeed fall for this particular argument, however.</p>
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            <title>Comment #28 by cogswellcogs</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 02:00:46 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/28</guid>
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				<p><strong>low-brow stuff on the internet? I'm shocked.</strong></p><p>From personal experience I know that the creationists, for example, have a wide spectrum of arguments running from very low brow to more nuanced attacks on evolution. &nbsp;The average net warrior will tend to gravitate to the lower brow attacks as these are easier to grasp and require little investment of their time. &nbsp;</p><p>
In fact on the average internet forum you'd be hard pressed to hear anything but the low brow efforts. </p>
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				<p><strong>low-brow stuff on the internet? I'm shocked.</strong></p><p>From personal experience I know that the creationists, for example, have a wide spectrum of arguments running from very low brow to more nuanced attacks on evolution. &nbsp;The average net warrior will tend to gravitate to the lower brow attacks as these are easier to grasp and require little investment of their time. &nbsp;</p><p>
In fact on the average internet forum you'd be hard pressed to hear anything but the low brow efforts. </p>
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            <title>Comment #29 by GreyFlcn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 02:25:45 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/29</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>Handy tool<p><a href="http://greyfalcon.net/carbon2" rel="nofollow">http://greyfalcon.net/carbon2</a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Handy tool<p><a href="http://greyfalcon.net/carbon2" rel="nofollow">http://greyfalcon.net/carbon2</a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #30 by inuspike</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:48:19 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/30</guid>
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				<p><strong>Sorry if this was posted</strong></p><p>This should really be in the main article but the "not only is that wrong" part should be elaborated to point out that </p><p>
volcanoes emit 145-233 million tons of co2 in one year.</p><p>
human emissions come to 24 BILLION tons a year</p><p>
this was released by the secretary of the interior.</p>
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				<p><strong>Sorry if this was posted</strong></p><p>This should really be in the main article but the "not only is that wrong" part should be elaborated to point out that </p><p>
volcanoes emit 145-233 million tons of co2 in one year.</p><p>
human emissions come to 24 BILLION tons a year</p><p>
this was released by the secretary of the interior.</p>
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            <title>Comment #31 by megal</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 18:51:02 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/volcanoes-emit-more-co2-than-humans/31</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>RE: The SOA with reach:  Web-Oriented Architecture<p><a href="http://www.swftoaviconverter.com" rel="nofollow">swf to avi converter can convert SWF files to various audio videos like SWF to MP3 Converter, SWF to AAC Converter, SWF to WMA Converter, etc.</a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>RE: The SOA with reach:  Web-Oriented Architecture<p><a href="http://www.swftoaviconverter.com" rel="nofollow">swf to avi converter can convert SWF files to various audio videos like SWF to MP3 Converter, SWF to AAC Converter, SWF to WMA Converter, etc.</a></p></strong></p>
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