Where wind can displace fossil fuel use in in combination with grid-controlled geo-exchange systems in buildings that are currently heating with gas, oil, or propane.

When the supply of wind energy picks up a quantity of units can by cycled on to take advantage of the extra power by initiating a service cycle and units already on could stay on for 1-2º C past the normal off  point.

When the wind supply temporarily drops on-cycles could be delayed for several minutes while off cycles are initiated .5º C short of goal temperatures.

Spread over thousands or millions of units most residents would never notice the difference. In the meantime a huge amount of fossil fuel consumption could be avoided.

Put the Carbon Back

Romm,
I'm gonna have to disagree with you there.

You are confusing stated goals, with actual goals.

_

The "real" Pickens Plan is one word: Shale

i.e. Convince Americans to remove any and all environmental restrictions from extracting carbon/water intensive Methane/Oil from Shale formations.
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/08/study-unconvent.h ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xa3kPY1Vdjk

And from a climate perspective this is equally scary as say.... Permafrost, and Methane Hydrates.
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/01/scientists-link.h ...
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2008-05/uoc--lmr05 ...
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/e ...
http://solveclimate.com/blog/20080903/new-report-caculate ...

-David Ahlport

Existing cars can be converted to dual fuel gasoline / natural gas, for under $2,000. The manufacturers could mass produce huge numbers of well integrated dual fuel cars for less than that.

The manufacturers cannot mass produce huge numbers of electric cars due to lack of battery, motor and semiconductor mass production.

The cost increase for electric cars of comparable range speed and size is many times $2,000.

60% dual  cycle plants are very expensive, normally used in baseload applications. They don't like being throttle jockey'd and loose efficiency when run off design point.

A lot of natural gas is used in buildings for heating and industrial applications that could be converted to electricity, making the potential transportation supply larger than assumed here.

The mass production of floating nuclear power plants can provide massive supplies of low emission electricity without the intermittency problem.

http://www.atomicinsights.com/aug96/Offshore.html

Shifting as much NG as possible into transportation can reduce oil imports more, and more quickly than any other single thing that is practical in the short to intermediate time span.

Things Everybody Should Know About Energy

Hi, I work for WindEnergy7.com, what we do is design, develop, and sell wind/solar hybrid systems for homeowners and small communities.  The thing I do not like about Pickens Plan is this...

What's the difference to Joe Homeowner if he's sending his electricity bill to Boone Pickens or existing giant utility?  Cost is same or more either way.  The problem with our electricity, oil, NG is all the same, WE HAVE NO CONTROL at all.  We are literally enslaved by systematic monopoly powers.  The big fatcats will control us completely until we get our own power.  Whether it's a windmill, coal plant, NG, whatever.

We must generate our own electricity, free yourself.  The savings in electricity cost will pay for the investment, 7 to 10 years you are in free power.  By then, electric cars will be reality, normalcy.  Plug it in, charge it up, away you go.  Dont you see people?  The revolution isn't that we make cleaner energy...  The revolution IS that we make OUR OWN energy.  Thatr's far more than just environmental, it's economical, it's freedom baby.  Being enslaved to giant ugly windmill farms is simply missing the REAL POINT to me.  Peace Out.

http://windenergy7.com/IMAGES-green-wind-energy/wind-powe ...

-- Wind Power Home -- You're Thinking It, We're Doing It

I'm with you on all that.  Growing up on a ranch in west Texas, the pickups ran on propane conversion kits.  If we ran out, could quickly start running on gasoline with the flip of a switch.  There's no reason this can't be done for passenger cars.  It's simply availability.  I say why wait for Detroit etc.  The aftermarket with help of chains like PepBoys, Western Auto, Midas, etc.  Start with the most common late model cars to make available the kits.

Propane is $2.65 a gallon where I am at.  For the Nuclear, it's too risky, sure we have managed it etc.  Or have we?  Pakistan, Iran, etc.  Models like France don't store their own waste.  If it's so great, why does France ship it somewhere else?  It's just too dangerous.. Chenobyl, just one terrorist attack away from having that in US.  I'm just not for the Nuclear, I'm not against it retroactively, I just don't favor it as a progressive direction.

http://windenergy7.com/turbines/

-- Wind Power Home -- You're Thinking It, We're Doing It

The cost increase for electric cars of comparable range speed and size is many times $2,000.

First, for pure EVs, the Better Place model is that you pay for the battery pack and electricity on a monthly basis for less than what you spend on gasoline.  This is a cost savings.

Second, plug-in hybrids reduce the battery pack size, so that up-front cost increase is minimized, and that increase is recouped in much lower per-mile costs.  For detailed data on CV, HEV, PHEV-20, and PHEV-60 costs, see  http://www.epriweb.com/public/000000000001000349.pdf

Going off grid for water means drilling and maintaining a well. Going off gird for sewer means building and maintaining a septic system. Going off grid for power means wood stoves and expensive high maintenance solar and wind systems.

Going off grid is not really something we should be striving for. You lose the economy of scale and the ability to share power with neighbors.  Off grid is not to be confused with distributed power generation.

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world

tank put in their trunk and modifications to their engine to run natural gas. I see pickups with gas tanks in their bed all the time. You can pop in to any number of places to get it refilled. What are you waiting for?

Replacing the fuel burned in a Hummer is not a rational goal. The goal is to replace the Hummer with radically more efficient vehicles. The price of transport fuel can double without affecting budgets if gas mileage has doubled.

Attempting to hold constant the cost of driving today's cars is a tail chasing exercise. The rising price of transport fuel will spur innovation. People will find ways to use much less of it.

Natural gas should be used as a bridge to replace coal, not oil.

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world

I don't understand the hesitance to use natural gas as a bridge fuel.

Simple answer.  

Because there's never anything so permanent as "temporary".  We aren't going to make a gigantic new set of infrastructure, and then rapidly remove it in one year. Infrastructure on average lasts for 30 years.  So building new infrastructure and expecting it to go away in 5 years is stupid.
Even at it's best, it's slightly worse than diesel emissions.  And significantly worse than a hybrid.
http://greyfalcon.net/electriccars3.png
As mentioned, above.  We don't have enough conventional natural gas to do that.  Which of course would lead to increased demand for "alternative natural gas" from shale formations.
Natural gas from Shale formations would be the carbon emissions equivalent of driving on Liquid Coal.
Lastly, in order for a "bridge", to be a bridge, it has to kick off the SAME types of products and expertise.  If we are going to assume that we need a BRIDGE, and that the end goal is Electric drive.  Then our BRIDGE should be Hybrids.  Then Plugin Hybrid Electric Vehicles.  Then Fully Electric Vehicles.

-David Ahlport

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world

:) Is it tea-time in the USA ?

Let's think in terms of eco-dollars.

I happen to be sipping on some "Earl Grey ...hot!" The closest thing we have to tea-time over here is happy hour, sometimes referred to as beer thirty or wine o'clock.

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world