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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Vegan vixen designs shoe collection]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Erik Hoffner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 07:17:33 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>too bad<p>Good initiative on her part. But the fact that "all proceeds will benefit The Nature Conservancy" is unfortunate...we see so many celebs doing the right thing these days, and then giving the green to the Big 10 again and again...where the least good will happen with it, arguably.<p>
Erik<br>


<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>too bad<p>Good initiative on her part. But the fact that "all proceeds will benefit The Nature Conservancy" is unfortunate...we see so many celebs doing the right thing these days, and then giving the green to the Big 10 again and again...where the least good will happen with it, arguably.<p>
Erik<br>


<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Sean Casten</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 07:44:37 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>I can't resist<p>From last night's <a href="http://www.imsdb.com/transcripts/South-Park-Fun-With-Veal.html" rel="nofollow">South Park re-run:<p>
DR. DOCTOR: He's very lucky you got him here when you did. He was in a very advanced state of vaginitis.<p>
RANDY: Vaginitis?<p>
DR. DOCTOR: It occurs when a person stops eating meat. Those sores on his skin were actually small &nbsp;vaginas. &nbsp;If we hadn't stopped it in time, Stan would have eventually just become one great big giant pussy.<p>
KYLE: Whoa, dude.<p>
DR. DOCTOR: We've got an IV of pure beef blood pumping into Stan's veins and the... sores are fading.<p>
CARTMAN: Thank God we stopped it in time.<p>
STAN: Well, I guess we learned somethng today: it's wrong to eat veal because the animals are so horribly mistreated, but if you don't eat meat at all you break out in vaginas. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; </p></p></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>I can't resist<p>From last night's <a href="http://www.imsdb.com/transcripts/South-Park-Fun-With-Veal.html" rel="nofollow">South Park re-run:<p>
DR. DOCTOR: He's very lucky you got him here when you did. He was in a very advanced state of vaginitis.<p>
RANDY: Vaginitis?<p>
DR. DOCTOR: It occurs when a person stops eating meat. Those sores on his skin were actually small &nbsp;vaginas. &nbsp;If we hadn't stopped it in time, Stan would have eventually just become one great big giant pussy.<p>
KYLE: Whoa, dude.<p>
DR. DOCTOR: We've got an IV of pure beef blood pumping into Stan's veins and the... sores are fading.<p>
CARTMAN: Thank God we stopped it in time.<p>
STAN: Well, I guess we learned somethng today: it's wrong to eat veal because the animals are so horribly mistreated, but if you don't eat meat at all you break out in vaginas. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; </p></p></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by GreenWeevil</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 07:51:48 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>Good for her. Good for us.</strong></p><p>Maybe it's not the perfect choice of Eco-org's to donate prceeds too for eco super-insiders. I don't know. I, personally, like the work of the Nature Conservancy. In any case, I really like that Natalie is doing this. She saw a way she countribute responsibly and she's trying to. By the way, if anyone missed the special she did on tv focusing on endangered species, it was good... look it up. Natalie is gorgeous and talented and I hope she'll continue to use her spotlight, charisma and talent to bring attention to responsible living! And I hope soldiers in the eco-Revolution, like Mr. Hoffner, stick to their dedication and passion and keep making a difference! Peace.</p>
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				<p><strong>Good for her. Good for us.</strong></p><p>Maybe it's not the perfect choice of Eco-org's to donate prceeds too for eco super-insiders. I don't know. I, personally, like the work of the Nature Conservancy. In any case, I really like that Natalie is doing this. She saw a way she countribute responsibly and she's trying to. By the way, if anyone missed the special she did on tv focusing on endangered species, it was good... look it up. Natalie is gorgeous and talented and I hope she'll continue to use her spotlight, charisma and talent to bring attention to responsible living! And I hope soldiers in the eco-Revolution, like Mr. Hoffner, stick to their dedication and passion and keep making a difference! Peace.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by Pangolin</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 08:02:51 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Sure they look good....<p>and they're eco-friendly vegan shoes and all...<p>
But how do they taste? 

<p><a href="http://putcarbonback.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">Put  the Carbon Back</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Sure they look good....<p>and they're eco-friendly vegan shoes and all...<p>
But how do they taste? 

<p><a href="http://putcarbonback.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">Put  the Carbon Back</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by kimberleywoelich</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 12:50:52 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>I hope this a starting trend,</strong></p><p>I hope this a starting trend, for ending animal cruelty! And too all the people that buy fur! erm,,, - maybe they can understand why its better to be ethical and be fashionable! </p>
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				<p><strong>I hope this a starting trend,</strong></p><p>I hope this a starting trend, for ending animal cruelty! And too all the people that buy fur! erm,,, - maybe they can understand why its better to be ethical and be fashionable! </p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by caniscandida</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 16:25:59 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>a little crush here, a little crush there</strong></p><p>Natalie Portman is indeed a strikingly beautiful woman. &nbsp;It should not go unremarked, though, that her co-star in the last two "Star Wars" movies, Hayden Christensen, is also one of the most beautiful people on the planet. &nbsp;And for that matter, Ewan McGregor has a well-deserved following too (though we were nonplussed by a shirtless scene that he did in something or other, maybe "Down With Love").</p><p>
Erik,<br>
I certainly agree that the smaller environmental organizations, as well as local chapters of the large ones, should be cultivated. &nbsp;But I do not know if it is so much an issue of effectiveness (or efficiency or whatever). &nbsp;Both kinds of organization can be effective, on their respective scales; and the Nature Conservancy (in which I used to keep a membership, many years ago, but no longer -- not for any fault of theirs) and the others of that size, with offices of professionals in DC and other large cities, certainly need large pots of capital for the kinds of projects that they are committed to undertaking.</p><p>
But you are absolutely right, there is definitely something very appealing about helping along any of the numerous grassroots projects that you look out for. &nbsp;And not just appealing: that personal contact, that establishing of serious relationships with small numbers of committed persons, is essential, IMHO, to the serene vitality of the environmentalist movement.</p><p>
To get back to Natalie's pumps, though, it seems to me not altogether obvious why, if she is vegan, and interested in sparing the cattle and other animals raised for their hides, she chose TNC as the beneficiary. &nbsp;Not that there is anything wrong with TNC; and what they do is of terrific benefit to wildlife and biodiversity. &nbsp;But there are other organizations that work much more directly on behalf of farm animals.</p><p>
And then, there is a totally different ethical issue: Even though no animal (presumably) suffered and died to produce faux-patent leather, nevertheless, if the faux-leather still looks like leather, then the wearer may still be understood to be signaling that wearing leather is cool or OK. &nbsp;I am not myself saying that that must be the case, and that therefore faux-leather is no good. &nbsp;But there are people involved in animal welfare who would make that argument.</p><p>
Sean,<br>
the lofty discourse of "South Park" once again soars heavenward, way above my muddled earth-bound head.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>a little crush here, a little crush there</strong></p><p>Natalie Portman is indeed a strikingly beautiful woman. &nbsp;It should not go unremarked, though, that her co-star in the last two "Star Wars" movies, Hayden Christensen, is also one of the most beautiful people on the planet. &nbsp;And for that matter, Ewan McGregor has a well-deserved following too (though we were nonplussed by a shirtless scene that he did in something or other, maybe "Down With Love").</p><p>
Erik,<br>
I certainly agree that the smaller environmental organizations, as well as local chapters of the large ones, should be cultivated. &nbsp;But I do not know if it is so much an issue of effectiveness (or efficiency or whatever). &nbsp;Both kinds of organization can be effective, on their respective scales; and the Nature Conservancy (in which I used to keep a membership, many years ago, but no longer -- not for any fault of theirs) and the others of that size, with offices of professionals in DC and other large cities, certainly need large pots of capital for the kinds of projects that they are committed to undertaking.</p><p>
But you are absolutely right, there is definitely something very appealing about helping along any of the numerous grassroots projects that you look out for. &nbsp;And not just appealing: that personal contact, that establishing of serious relationships with small numbers of committed persons, is essential, IMHO, to the serene vitality of the environmentalist movement.</p><p>
To get back to Natalie's pumps, though, it seems to me not altogether obvious why, if she is vegan, and interested in sparing the cattle and other animals raised for their hides, she chose TNC as the beneficiary. &nbsp;Not that there is anything wrong with TNC; and what they do is of terrific benefit to wildlife and biodiversity. &nbsp;But there are other organizations that work much more directly on behalf of farm animals.</p><p>
And then, there is a totally different ethical issue: Even though no animal (presumably) suffered and died to produce faux-patent leather, nevertheless, if the faux-leather still looks like leather, then the wearer may still be understood to be signaling that wearing leather is cool or OK. &nbsp;I am not myself saying that that must be the case, and that therefore faux-leather is no good. &nbsp;But there are people involved in animal welfare who would make that argument.</p><p>
Sean,<br>
the lofty discourse of "South Park" once again soars heavenward, way above my muddled earth-bound head.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by Erik Hoffner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 00:33:13 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>big and small<p>Thanks, Canis.<p>
My point, I guess, is that the Big 10, or however many there are, really don't need celebrity help. After reading one of the 10's magazines recently, I noted in the back-of-the-mag a list of all of the people doing fundraising work at their main DC office, and it was close to 20 people. Then there's all the folks in all of its regional and state offices working to raise money, too. Each of the Big 10 have an army of help, and will always find a way to raise the money they need for their missions, which are important, I agree. &nbsp;<p>
But to put a relatively unknown yet effective project in the spotlight could win it so many more supporters, and bolster its mission and ability to make a difference hugely. Many grassroots groups are only constrained in the amount of good they can do by their budgets. <p>
Projects that rescue unwanted animals from the pet trade would be a perfect match for this, or human development organizations like Green Empowerment, which installs renewable energy systems in remote villages in the developing world, empowering indigenous people to stay put in their home places while allowing them to refrigerate medicine or vaccines or use a satellite phone in case of an emergency. <a href="http://greenempowerment.org" rel="nofollow">http://greenempowerment.org<p>
Snow Leopard Trust is another. (Natalie's people, call me!) They've got an amazing staff on the ground around Central Asia working collaboratively to ensure that this majestic creature keeps dropping on yaks from icy ledges for all time: <a href="http://www.snowleopard.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.snowleopard.org<p>
So the options are enormous for someone looking to make a difference. Of the 1,100 groups in the Orion Grassroots Network, 2/3 have a staff of between 1 and 5 people, and a small budget to match. A funding opportunity offered by celebrity endorsement/donation could mean an awful lot to these groups.<p>
All that said, it also seems to me that the donating of proceeds to a very well known group is probably an important part of the marketing. Not many folks have yet heard of Green Empowerment, compared to the Nature Conservancy, even though they're doing great work on behalf of people and planet. <p>
Erik

<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></p></p></p></a></p></a></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>big and small<p>Thanks, Canis.<p>
My point, I guess, is that the Big 10, or however many there are, really don't need celebrity help. After reading one of the 10's magazines recently, I noted in the back-of-the-mag a list of all of the people doing fundraising work at their main DC office, and it was close to 20 people. Then there's all the folks in all of its regional and state offices working to raise money, too. Each of the Big 10 have an army of help, and will always find a way to raise the money they need for their missions, which are important, I agree. &nbsp;<p>
But to put a relatively unknown yet effective project in the spotlight could win it so many more supporters, and bolster its mission and ability to make a difference hugely. Many grassroots groups are only constrained in the amount of good they can do by their budgets. <p>
Projects that rescue unwanted animals from the pet trade would be a perfect match for this, or human development organizations like Green Empowerment, which installs renewable energy systems in remote villages in the developing world, empowering indigenous people to stay put in their home places while allowing them to refrigerate medicine or vaccines or use a satellite phone in case of an emergency. <a href="http://greenempowerment.org" rel="nofollow">http://greenempowerment.org<p>
Snow Leopard Trust is another. (Natalie's people, call me!) They've got an amazing staff on the ground around Central Asia working collaboratively to ensure that this majestic creature keeps dropping on yaks from icy ledges for all time: <a href="http://www.snowleopard.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.snowleopard.org<p>
So the options are enormous for someone looking to make a difference. Of the 1,100 groups in the Orion Grassroots Network, 2/3 have a staff of between 1 and 5 people, and a small budget to match. A funding opportunity offered by celebrity endorsement/donation could mean an awful lot to these groups.<p>
All that said, it also seems to me that the donating of proceeds to a very well known group is probably an important part of the marketing. Not many folks have yet heard of Green Empowerment, compared to the Nature Conservancy, even though they're doing great work on behalf of people and planet. <p>
Erik

<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></p></p></p></a></p></a></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Greta</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 05:07:20 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>Natalie, All Pumped Up</strong></p><p>She is hotter than most because she is a vegan. But, I have to deduct points for her being a smoker. Yuck! Too bad. (How could anyone be so conscientious/healthy as to be a vegan but then smoke cigarettes. Twisted logic.)</p><p>
Something like the Farm Sanctuary, Animal Acres (or other farm animal rights advocates) -- kinda offset the slaughter of cows -- would have been a nice association.</p><p>
The world would be a better place with more vaginas. &nbsp;If men weren't such dicks, they'd be vaginas. &nbsp;I'm just saying.

<p>www.NoPunProductions.com ~ AmericaTheGreen.org</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Natalie, All Pumped Up</strong></p><p>She is hotter than most because she is a vegan. But, I have to deduct points for her being a smoker. Yuck! Too bad. (How could anyone be so conscientious/healthy as to be a vegan but then smoke cigarettes. Twisted logic.)</p><p>
Something like the Farm Sanctuary, Animal Acres (or other farm animal rights advocates) -- kinda offset the slaughter of cows -- would have been a nice association.</p><p>
The world would be a better place with more vaginas. &nbsp;If men weren't such dicks, they'd be vaginas. &nbsp;I'm just saying.

<p>www.NoPunProductions.com ~ AmericaTheGreen.org</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by caniscandida</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 05:10:59 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>what about the kids who look up to you?</strong></p><p>(See the SNL "gangsta" video, which is a gem.)</p><p>
Yes, Erik, the celebrity endorsement/donation for a small group that next to no one has heard of would mean a great deal. &nbsp;</p><p>
E.g., the Snow Leopard Trust sounds brilliant. &nbsp;It is easy enough to see how valuable it is likely to be for entire interrelated ecosystems, just to concentrate on that single charismatic species. &nbsp;By the same token, maintaining the staff, providing for transportation between the US and the Himalayas, and supporting research not just on the natural-science aspects (e.g., how many leopards are there in any particular location?; are their numbers growing or shrinking?; what are they eating?) but on a number of other people-oriented subjects (economics, sociology, politics), obviously require a certain amount of steady substantial funding.</p><p>
Next time I run into Natalie, I shall have to ask her why she chose the Nature Conservancy. &nbsp;And of course I shall mention the snow leopards.</p><p>
One suspicion I have is that she may originally have been inclining to name PETA the beneficiary, or some subsidiary of PETA, but then was dissuaded because of the not altogether fair disfavor that PETA has won for itself in the minds of many.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></p>
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				<p><strong>what about the kids who look up to you?</strong></p><p>(See the SNL "gangsta" video, which is a gem.)</p><p>
Yes, Erik, the celebrity endorsement/donation for a small group that next to no one has heard of would mean a great deal. &nbsp;</p><p>
E.g., the Snow Leopard Trust sounds brilliant. &nbsp;It is easy enough to see how valuable it is likely to be for entire interrelated ecosystems, just to concentrate on that single charismatic species. &nbsp;By the same token, maintaining the staff, providing for transportation between the US and the Himalayas, and supporting research not just on the natural-science aspects (e.g., how many leopards are there in any particular location?; are their numbers growing or shrinking?; what are they eating?) but on a number of other people-oriented subjects (economics, sociology, politics), obviously require a certain amount of steady substantial funding.</p><p>
Next time I run into Natalie, I shall have to ask her why she chose the Nature Conservancy. &nbsp;And of course I shall mention the snow leopards.</p><p>
One suspicion I have is that she may originally have been inclining to name PETA the beneficiary, or some subsidiary of PETA, but then was dissuaded because of the not altogether fair disfavor that PETA has won for itself in the minds of many.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by Greta</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 05:19:48 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>If Looks Could Kill</strong></p><p>And then, there is a totally different ethical issue: Even though no animal (presumably) suffered and died to produce faux-patent leather, nevertheless, if the faux-leather still looks like leather, then the wearer may still be understood to be signaling that wearing leather is cool or OK.</p><p>
Your Chuck Taylor's can take you only so far. Pretty much, everything that is non-fabric looks like leather...and this is most shoes. I think that it is not quite the same as fur and faux fur, which look so distinctly like the actual animal.

<p>www.NoPunProductions.com ~ AmericaTheGreen.org</p></p>
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				<p><strong>If Looks Could Kill</strong></p><p>And then, there is a totally different ethical issue: Even though no animal (presumably) suffered and died to produce faux-patent leather, nevertheless, if the faux-leather still looks like leather, then the wearer may still be understood to be signaling that wearing leather is cool or OK.</p><p>
Your Chuck Taylor's can take you only so far. Pretty much, everything that is non-fabric looks like leather...and this is most shoes. I think that it is not quite the same as fur and faux fur, which look so distinctly like the actual animal.

<p>www.NoPunProductions.com ~ AmericaTheGreen.org</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #11 by caniscandida</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 05:57:07 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/11</guid>
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				<p><strong>vaginas vs. dicks; Farm Sanctuary</strong></p><p>Yes, Greta; and that bit of "South Park" dialogue nicely illustrates that curious paradox in (some) male psychology, the co-existent fascination with the female body, and the horror of it.</p><p>
About another part of the female body which draws the pleasurable attention of many men, some clever French thinker observed, "Men have great fondness for women's breasts; but they would never wish to have them themselves."</p><p>
On organizations promoting the welfare of farm animals: I think I first heard of Farm Sanctuary not long ago, when, back in November, one of their spokespersons did a Q&amp;A on turkeys at bestfriends.org. &nbsp;They are a great group.</p><p>
Have you seen the recent movie "The Year of the Dog"? &nbsp;I do not recommend it; the basic idea is promising -- how a 30-something (40-something?) single woman reacts to the death of her dog (a very sweet little beagle), and to the lack of understanding of the people around her -- , but in fact they are an uninteresting collection of bubbleheads, and the movie is pretty joyless.</p><p>
Anyway, the heroine "adopts" a chicken for her young niece, at some farm in southern California which gives a comfortable safe home to farm animals; and they spend a happy afternoon visiting the chicken and all the other animals. &nbsp;I got the impression that it is a real place, not just made up for the movie, but I did not make note of its name.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></p>
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				<p><strong>vaginas vs. dicks; Farm Sanctuary</strong></p><p>Yes, Greta; and that bit of "South Park" dialogue nicely illustrates that curious paradox in (some) male psychology, the co-existent fascination with the female body, and the horror of it.</p><p>
About another part of the female body which draws the pleasurable attention of many men, some clever French thinker observed, "Men have great fondness for women's breasts; but they would never wish to have them themselves."</p><p>
On organizations promoting the welfare of farm animals: I think I first heard of Farm Sanctuary not long ago, when, back in November, one of their spokespersons did a Q&amp;A on turkeys at bestfriends.org. &nbsp;They are a great group.</p><p>
Have you seen the recent movie "The Year of the Dog"? &nbsp;I do not recommend it; the basic idea is promising -- how a 30-something (40-something?) single woman reacts to the death of her dog (a very sweet little beagle), and to the lack of understanding of the people around her -- , but in fact they are an uninteresting collection of bubbleheads, and the movie is pretty joyless.</p><p>
Anyway, the heroine "adopts" a chicken for her young niece, at some farm in southern California which gives a comfortable safe home to farm animals; and they spend a happy afternoon visiting the chicken and all the other animals. &nbsp;I got the impression that it is a real place, not just made up for the movie, but I did not make note of its name.

<p>Chickens are our cousins!  So are fish!  So are other sentient animals!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by amc89</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 13:49:32 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>variety and styles of vegan shoes</strong></p><p>There's been a lot of info lately about eating lower on the food chain to help fight climate change, habitat loss and pollution, as well as animal suffering, but not as much has been said about "dressing lower on the food chain", so I'm glad to see a high profile celeb launch a non-leather, non-fur line. (Yes, some designers actually put real fur trim on boots!)</p><p>
The more variety and styles of vegan shoes, the better. Personally I look for affordable when I look for non-leather shoes, but I realize there are many fashionistas out there who need a good pair of fancy shoes and if there are an increasing amount of vegan versions of dress shoes, that's great. &nbsp;Though I rarely buy shoes, or any new clothing item in general, I like the UK-based Vegetarian Shoes company because they're sweatshop free and fairly affordable.</p>
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				<p><strong>variety and styles of vegan shoes</strong></p><p>There's been a lot of info lately about eating lower on the food chain to help fight climate change, habitat loss and pollution, as well as animal suffering, but not as much has been said about "dressing lower on the food chain", so I'm glad to see a high profile celeb launch a non-leather, non-fur line. (Yes, some designers actually put real fur trim on boots!)</p><p>
The more variety and styles of vegan shoes, the better. Personally I look for affordable when I look for non-leather shoes, but I realize there are many fashionistas out there who need a good pair of fancy shoes and if there are an increasing amount of vegan versions of dress shoes, that's great. &nbsp;Though I rarely buy shoes, or any new clothing item in general, I like the UK-based Vegetarian Shoes company because they're sweatshop free and fairly affordable.</p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by brenna</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 14:08:25 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Animal-Friendly vs. Eco-Friendly</strong></p><p>I think it's great that she wants to bring her celebrity to a cause she must hold very dear after being a vegan for "several months" as she was quoted in People magazine. I have to wonder how much choice she was given regarding style and where the donated proceeds would go. I think celebrity's often lend their name to things they actually don't have much input in.</p><p>
I also wonder what materials were actually used. With small exception, most non-leather shoes are made with PVC. Not exactly the most eco-friendly material. So what's more important?

<p>Brenna</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Animal-Friendly vs. Eco-Friendly</strong></p><p>I think it's great that she wants to bring her celebrity to a cause she must hold very dear after being a vegan for "several months" as she was quoted in People magazine. I have to wonder how much choice she was given regarding style and where the donated proceeds would go. I think celebrity's often lend their name to things they actually don't have much input in.</p><p>
I also wonder what materials were actually used. With small exception, most non-leather shoes are made with PVC. Not exactly the most eco-friendly material. So what's more important?

<p>Brenna</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #14 by C4nier</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jan 2008 06:00:32 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>No, PVC is never green, but....</strong></p><p>Brenna is right to point out that eco-friendly is not the same as animal-friendly, and PVC is an especially evil oil product that should be avoided whenever possible. But it's not necessarily true non-leather = PVC. In fact, many shoes marketed as vegan do not use PVC or vinyl, e.g. check out mooshoes.com. &nbsp;Polyurethane is the common PVC replacement nowadays. &nbsp;It's still petro-based, but not as toxic as PVC. It's also true that if you buy a leather shoe you might still be buying PVC, which may be in the sole or other components of construction. &nbsp;Some of the larger shoe companies, including Nike and Reebok, no longer use vinyl or PVC in any of their shoes. But others like Saucony, New Balance, and even our old Chuck Taylor maker, Converse, among other companies, still use it. (Greenpeace has more info on this). &nbsp;</p><p>
Of course, even if leather shoes don't have PVC in their construction they still can have harsh environmental impacts beyond the environmental costs and oil inputs of raising the cows. &nbsp;Tanning compounds, usually industrial salts, are notoriously hard to dispose of. &nbsp;I heard an NPR story recently that pointed to hexavalent chromium as still being the most commonly used tanning compound because of its low price. &nbsp; Sound familiar? &nbsp;It's the compound that was found in the drinking water in "Erin Brokovich". &nbsp;But you don't have to drink the stuff, it's also toxic when inhaled. &nbsp;In "A Civil Action" it's a tannery that polluted the ground water with TCE (trichloroethylene), a common industrial solvent. &nbsp; Okay, enough environmental pop culture, but seriously, tanneries are, and have been for centuries, eco-nightmares! &nbsp;</p><p>
Ultimately, we should be trying to reduce our overall consumption and just make do with the shoes that we have. &nbsp;I suppose it's kinda nice that Natalie Portman is stumping for non-leather shoes. &nbsp;But how much does a $250 pair of shoes affect the consumption habits of everyday Americans? &nbsp;The most animal and planet-friendly shoes are still the ones that you wear for a really long time. &nbsp;"Green" or "animal-friendly" &nbsp;consumption is still consumption. &nbsp; </p>
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				<p><strong>No, PVC is never green, but....</strong></p><p>Brenna is right to point out that eco-friendly is not the same as animal-friendly, and PVC is an especially evil oil product that should be avoided whenever possible. But it's not necessarily true non-leather = PVC. In fact, many shoes marketed as vegan do not use PVC or vinyl, e.g. check out mooshoes.com. &nbsp;Polyurethane is the common PVC replacement nowadays. &nbsp;It's still petro-based, but not as toxic as PVC. It's also true that if you buy a leather shoe you might still be buying PVC, which may be in the sole or other components of construction. &nbsp;Some of the larger shoe companies, including Nike and Reebok, no longer use vinyl or PVC in any of their shoes. But others like Saucony, New Balance, and even our old Chuck Taylor maker, Converse, among other companies, still use it. (Greenpeace has more info on this). &nbsp;</p><p>
Of course, even if leather shoes don't have PVC in their construction they still can have harsh environmental impacts beyond the environmental costs and oil inputs of raising the cows. &nbsp;Tanning compounds, usually industrial salts, are notoriously hard to dispose of. &nbsp;I heard an NPR story recently that pointed to hexavalent chromium as still being the most commonly used tanning compound because of its low price. &nbsp; Sound familiar? &nbsp;It's the compound that was found in the drinking water in "Erin Brokovich". &nbsp;But you don't have to drink the stuff, it's also toxic when inhaled. &nbsp;In "A Civil Action" it's a tannery that polluted the ground water with TCE (trichloroethylene), a common industrial solvent. &nbsp; Okay, enough environmental pop culture, but seriously, tanneries are, and have been for centuries, eco-nightmares! &nbsp;</p><p>
Ultimately, we should be trying to reduce our overall consumption and just make do with the shoes that we have. &nbsp;I suppose it's kinda nice that Natalie Portman is stumping for non-leather shoes. &nbsp;But how much does a $250 pair of shoes affect the consumption habits of everyday Americans? &nbsp;The most animal and planet-friendly shoes are still the ones that you wear for a really long time. &nbsp;"Green" or "animal-friendly" &nbsp;consumption is still consumption. &nbsp; </p>
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            <title>Comment #15 by John former Marine</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jan 2008 06:17:32 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>vegans don't wear designer clothes...</strong></p><p>Come on...what vegan needs a $2,000 eco-animal-friendly purse or $500 vegan shoes? &nbsp;How about Natalie pushing a vegan eco-friendly shoe that you can get for $15 at Walmart? &nbsp;That'll make a difference. &nbsp;In case she hasn't noticed, the poor 90% of the population (that don't buy designer clothes) make up 90% of the population. &nbsp;The richest 10% only make up 10% of the population...and they can screw themselves. &nbsp;Wearing leather is the least of their karma problems.

<p>Shu pas a vende.</p></p>
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				<p><strong>vegans don't wear designer clothes...</strong></p><p>Come on...what vegan needs a $2,000 eco-animal-friendly purse or $500 vegan shoes? &nbsp;How about Natalie pushing a vegan eco-friendly shoe that you can get for $15 at Walmart? &nbsp;That'll make a difference. &nbsp;In case she hasn't noticed, the poor 90% of the population (that don't buy designer clothes) make up 90% of the population. &nbsp;The richest 10% only make up 10% of the population...and they can screw themselves. &nbsp;Wearing leather is the least of their karma problems.

<p>Shu pas a vende.</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #16 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jan 2008 10:52:34 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>The Nature Archipelago<p><br>
But the fact that "all proceeds will benefit The Nature Conservancy" is unfortunate<p>
I just read a really interesting essay in a new book, "The Future of Nature: Writing on a human ecology from Orion Magazine"<p>
<a href="http://www.milkweed.org/component/page,shop.product_details/flypage,shop.flypage/product_id,843/option,com_phpshop/Itemid,8/" rel="nofollow">http://www.milkweed.org/component/page,shop.product_detai ...<p>
The essay is called "Conservation Refugees" and it speaks about native people are a displaced by the Nature Syndicate! &nbsp; <p>
One fact from that essay stood out for me. &nbsp;Over twelve (12%) of the earths survees, 11.75 square miles, is no protected!! &nbsp;That's incredible! &nbsp; When we speak of "big oil" running things, we also have to think about what "big Nature" is doing with all that land!!

<p>John A. Bailo<br>
Inhofe 400 Wannabe<br>
<b><a href="http://log.texeme.com" rel="nofollow">My Log</a></b></br></br></p></p></p></a></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>The Nature Archipelago<p><br>
But the fact that "all proceeds will benefit The Nature Conservancy" is unfortunate<p>
I just read a really interesting essay in a new book, "The Future of Nature: Writing on a human ecology from Orion Magazine"<p>
<a href="http://www.milkweed.org/component/page,shop.product_details/flypage,shop.flypage/product_id,843/option,com_phpshop/Itemid,8/" rel="nofollow">http://www.milkweed.org/component/page,shop.product_detai ...<p>
The essay is called "Conservation Refugees" and it speaks about native people are a displaced by the Nature Syndicate! &nbsp; <p>
One fact from that essay stood out for me. &nbsp;Over twelve (12%) of the earths survees, 11.75 square miles, is no protected!! &nbsp;That's incredible! &nbsp; When we speak of "big oil" running things, we also have to think about what "big Nature" is doing with all that land!!

<p>John A. Bailo<br>
Inhofe 400 Wannabe<br>
<b><a href="http://log.texeme.com" rel="nofollow">My Log</a></b></br></br></p></p></p></a></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #17 by ephermal public image</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 00:35:29 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>vegan shoes</strong></p><p>Faux patent leather shoes in Portman's line? &nbsp;Shoes of man-made materials have been around for decades. And just what are they made of? Certainly not animal skin, but chemicals galore, indeed. &nbsp;I was under the impression that Portman was a proponent of the environment as a whole - not simply a proponent of animals. &nbsp;Who is designing shoes with a sustainable resource in mind?</p>
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				<p><strong>vegan shoes</strong></p><p>Faux patent leather shoes in Portman's line? &nbsp;Shoes of man-made materials have been around for decades. And just what are they made of? Certainly not animal skin, but chemicals galore, indeed. &nbsp;I was under the impression that Portman was a proponent of the environment as a whole - not simply a proponent of animals. &nbsp;Who is designing shoes with a sustainable resource in mind?</p>
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            <title>Comment #18 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 01:01:16 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>&quot;It&quot; girl</strong></p><p>The green status "It" girl? &nbsp;</p><p>
How about a poll Grist? &nbsp;Who are the main competitors in this arena? &nbsp;Will the winner be eaten by lions? &nbsp;Polar bears?</p><p>
Will she pose with solar panels? &nbsp;Recline on giant wind machine blades hoisted by massive cranes. &nbsp;</p><p>
How about Hillary? &nbsp;Older women are currently in demand as sex symbols. &nbsp;The shallowness of the Brittainey/Paris gene pool has left the culture flat.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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				<p><strong>&quot;It&quot; girl</strong></p><p>The green status "It" girl? &nbsp;</p><p>
How about a poll Grist? &nbsp;Who are the main competitors in this arena? &nbsp;Will the winner be eaten by lions? &nbsp;Polar bears?</p><p>
Will she pose with solar panels? &nbsp;Recline on giant wind machine blades hoisted by massive cranes. &nbsp;</p><p>
How about Hillary? &nbsp;Older women are currently in demand as sex symbols. &nbsp;The shallowness of the Brittainey/Paris gene pool has left the culture flat.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #19 by Erik Hoffner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 01:36:08 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>conservation refugees<p>jabailo, yes, that article in Orion is pretty telling: it also names Conservation International and the Wildlife Conservation Society as big international ngos (BINGOS) that buy tracts of land and then relocate the human, often indigenous inhabitants out. The up side, they say, is that these people can now have nice jobs guiding tourists, but I don't think that they understand the irony of that.<p>
And it's created some surprising enemies for them:<br>
this quote stood out for me:<p>
"We are enemies of conservation," declared Maasai leader Martin Saning'o, standing before a session of the November 2004 World Conservation Congress sponsored by IUCN in Bangkok, Thailand. The nomadic Maasai, who have over the past thirty years lost most of their grazing range to conservation projects throughout eastern Africa, hadn't always felt that way. In fact, Saning'o reminded his audience, "...we were the original conservationists." <p>
The whole thing is here:<p>
<a href="http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/161/" rel="nofollow">http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/1 ...<p>
It's good that BINGOs like Nature Conservancy buy land with the money they raise, but sometimes their approach is lacking. <p>
Erik<br>


<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></br></p></p></a></p></p></p></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>conservation refugees<p>jabailo, yes, that article in Orion is pretty telling: it also names Conservation International and the Wildlife Conservation Society as big international ngos (BINGOS) that buy tracts of land and then relocate the human, often indigenous inhabitants out. The up side, they say, is that these people can now have nice jobs guiding tourists, but I don't think that they understand the irony of that.<p>
And it's created some surprising enemies for them:<br>
this quote stood out for me:<p>
"We are enemies of conservation," declared Maasai leader Martin Saning'o, standing before a session of the November 2004 World Conservation Congress sponsored by IUCN in Bangkok, Thailand. The nomadic Maasai, who have over the past thirty years lost most of their grazing range to conservation projects throughout eastern Africa, hadn't always felt that way. In fact, Saning'o reminded his audience, "...we were the original conservationists." <p>
The whole thing is here:<p>
<a href="http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/161/" rel="nofollow">http://www.orionmagazine.org/index.php/articles/article/1 ...<p>
It's good that BINGOs like Nature Conservancy buy land with the money they raise, but sometimes their approach is lacking. <p>
Erik<br>


<p><a href="http://www.orionsociety.org/ogn" rel="nofollow">The Orion Grassroots Network: 1,100+ grassroots groups working for conservation &amp; more
</a></p></br></p></p></a></p></p></p></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #20 by willa</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 11:46:35 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>inserttitlehere</strong></p><p>The richest 10% only make up 10% of the population...and they can screw themselves. &nbsp;Wearing leather is the least of their karma problems.<br>
John, you're right, BUT: &nbsp;the richest 10% also probably buy 90% of the consumer goods. &nbsp;So the goods they choose matter more, in that way, than the ones everyone else buys. &nbsp;I'm not saying the rich people matter more, I'm saying that influencing their choices matters more.</p><p>
Amazingdrx, how about we don't treat women of any age as decorative objects and then laugh about their death and dismemberment?</br></p>
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				<p><strong>inserttitlehere</strong></p><p>The richest 10% only make up 10% of the population...and they can screw themselves. &nbsp;Wearing leather is the least of their karma problems.<br>
John, you're right, BUT: &nbsp;the richest 10% also probably buy 90% of the consumer goods. &nbsp;So the goods they choose matter more, in that way, than the ones everyone else buys. &nbsp;I'm not saying the rich people matter more, I'm saying that influencing their choices matters more.</p><p>
Amazingdrx, how about we don't treat women of any age as decorative objects and then laugh about their death and dismemberment?</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #21 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 14:40:56 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Death and dismemberment</strong></p><p>Yow, the anger! &nbsp;Sorry, bad joke.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Death and dismemberment</strong></p><p>Yow, the anger! &nbsp;Sorry, bad joke.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #22 by willa</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 14:47:28 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>yes, bad joke</strong></p><p>I'm not actually angry. &nbsp;I just think it's worth pointing out when these sorts of things are tossed out as throwaway jokes no one even thinks about. &nbsp;The fact that no one thinks about them, or is very upset about them, is the problem. &nbsp;I'm sorry to have made you uncomfortable when it's just one example of something I hate in society as a whole.</p>
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				<p><strong>yes, bad joke</strong></p><p>I'm not actually angry. &nbsp;I just think it's worth pointing out when these sorts of things are tossed out as throwaway jokes no one even thinks about. &nbsp;The fact that no one thinks about them, or is very upset about them, is the problem. &nbsp;I'm sorry to have made you uncomfortable when it's just one example of something I hate in society as a whole.</p>
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            <title>Comment #23 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2008 16:31:34 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Think nothing of it</strong></p><p>All in a day's bloggerel. &nbsp;I'm sure I have said much more offensive things already. &nbsp;It's the nature of the beast.</p><p>
I too am angry as hell about pretty nearly everything in contemporary america, and I won't take it anymore! &nbsp;Yah yah yah, what not soup again! &nbsp;Ooops got carried away.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Think nothing of it</strong></p><p>All in a day's bloggerel. &nbsp;I'm sure I have said much more offensive things already. &nbsp;It's the nature of the beast.</p><p>
I too am angry as hell about pretty nearly everything in contemporary america, and I won't take it anymore! &nbsp;Yah yah yah, what not soup again! &nbsp;Ooops got carried away.

<p>http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #24 by rwhiten1</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/natalie-portmans-pumps/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 26 Feb 2008 04:34:18 -0800</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>*drool*</strong></p><p>Christ she is hot.</p>
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				<p><strong>*drool*</strong></p><p>Christ she is hot.</p>
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