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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for New Apollo Energy Act contrasts sharply with &#8220;Jurassic&#8221; GOP energy bill]]></title>
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	<description>Grist Comment Feed</description>
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            <title>Comment #1 by yuduke</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 18 May 2005 09:08:30 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Relation to Apollo Alliance<p>Is Rep. Inslee's proposed bill related to the work being done by the Apollo Alliance? &nbsp;(<a href="http://www.apolloalliance.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.apolloalliance.org)</a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Relation to Apollo Alliance<p>Is Rep. Inslee's proposed bill related to the work being done by the Apollo Alliance? &nbsp;(<a href="http://www.apolloalliance.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.apolloalliance.org)</a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 May 2005 01:10:50 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Government purchase of green energy products.</strong></p><p>I am surprised that this proposal does not include purchase of wind, solar, hybrid plugin vehicles, and biofuel for federal, state, and local government use.</p><p>
Government vehicles are replaced &nbsp;as they age, why not negotiate large orders of hybrid plugin vehicles with US automakers for this purpose? &nbsp;Orders that allow wholesale pricing and economies of scale to equalize purchase prices of this oil and money saving technology with regular vehicles.</p><p>
And incentives for local and state governments to favor these purchases with federal rebates...similar to the rebates that auto makers use to drive sales.</p><p>
With an upgrade and extension of the national power grid, government could also invest in wind and solar powered electricity to heat and cool it's facilities. &nbsp;Offices, military bases, schools...these needs amount to a signifigant portion of the energy used in the US. And could also foster economies of scale with large orders for this equipment.</p><p>
Mass production and installation will bring the price down and allow these systems to compete. &nbsp;</p><p>
If conventional automotive powerplants and utility generating equipment were produced as wind, solar, biofuel, and plugin hybrids are now, one at a time or at very low production levels,...we would most likely still be riding horses and driving buggies.</p><p>
There are already long waiting lists for Toyota's hybrid vehicles, even though their added initial cost at present fuel prices provides a limited incentive. &nbsp;Buyers are betting that fuel prices will rise at a rate well above the rate of inflation.</p><p>
This plan seems to have more political hype to it than actual funding and practical goals. &nbsp;Were a similat approach taken in the original Apollo Project, Russia would have beaten US to the moon.</p><p>
10 billion over 10 years is a more reasonable rate of investment of tax dollars given the cost of these oil wars, which is fast approaching the level of 200 billion dollars per year.</p><p>
Over 500 million dollars per day is now spent on imported oil by US consumers. &nbsp;Add another 500 million per day for oil wars...and that's over a billion per day, because we are dependent on imported oil.</p><p>
10 billion dollars per year for 10 years would fund the upgrade and extension of the national power grid to allow local power companies to invest in wind and solar power plants in areas that have an abundance of clean energy, like the high wind speed areas of the great plains, and the sunny desert southwest.</p><p>
And it would allow government to foster the manufacture of solar, wind, hybrid vehicles, and biofuel plants to meet it's own energy needs. &nbsp;As in WW 2 war production, government working with industry could win these oil wars.</p><p>
But this time with 10s of thousands of wind, solar, and biofuel plants and millions of hybrid plugin vehicles...instead of millions of jeeps, trucks, planes, ships, guns, bombs...</p><p>
American workers and factories could do it all again and the US manufacturing and tax base would be revitalized, providing good jobs once again for american families. &nbsp;The US would become an export leader of these oil and earth saving products.</p><p>
It's time for progressive politicians to throw caution to the wind (and sun) and take a chance. &nbsp;We are rapidly losing political power to the corporate shills, the neo-conservatives are planning never ending oil wars for global corporate empire. &nbsp;And their WMD and other lies are winning votes.</p><p>
There is no faithbased patriotism &nbsp;required to see that this new energy policy is truly patriotic, unlike these eternal oil wars and the terrorism that comes with them.</p>
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				<p><strong>Government purchase of green energy products.</strong></p><p>I am surprised that this proposal does not include purchase of wind, solar, hybrid plugin vehicles, and biofuel for federal, state, and local government use.</p><p>
Government vehicles are replaced &nbsp;as they age, why not negotiate large orders of hybrid plugin vehicles with US automakers for this purpose? &nbsp;Orders that allow wholesale pricing and economies of scale to equalize purchase prices of this oil and money saving technology with regular vehicles.</p><p>
And incentives for local and state governments to favor these purchases with federal rebates...similar to the rebates that auto makers use to drive sales.</p><p>
With an upgrade and extension of the national power grid, government could also invest in wind and solar powered electricity to heat and cool it's facilities. &nbsp;Offices, military bases, schools...these needs amount to a signifigant portion of the energy used in the US. And could also foster economies of scale with large orders for this equipment.</p><p>
Mass production and installation will bring the price down and allow these systems to compete. &nbsp;</p><p>
If conventional automotive powerplants and utility generating equipment were produced as wind, solar, biofuel, and plugin hybrids are now, one at a time or at very low production levels,...we would most likely still be riding horses and driving buggies.</p><p>
There are already long waiting lists for Toyota's hybrid vehicles, even though their added initial cost at present fuel prices provides a limited incentive. &nbsp;Buyers are betting that fuel prices will rise at a rate well above the rate of inflation.</p><p>
This plan seems to have more political hype to it than actual funding and practical goals. &nbsp;Were a similat approach taken in the original Apollo Project, Russia would have beaten US to the moon.</p><p>
10 billion over 10 years is a more reasonable rate of investment of tax dollars given the cost of these oil wars, which is fast approaching the level of 200 billion dollars per year.</p><p>
Over 500 million dollars per day is now spent on imported oil by US consumers. &nbsp;Add another 500 million per day for oil wars...and that's over a billion per day, because we are dependent on imported oil.</p><p>
10 billion dollars per year for 10 years would fund the upgrade and extension of the national power grid to allow local power companies to invest in wind and solar power plants in areas that have an abundance of clean energy, like the high wind speed areas of the great plains, and the sunny desert southwest.</p><p>
And it would allow government to foster the manufacture of solar, wind, hybrid vehicles, and biofuel plants to meet it's own energy needs. &nbsp;As in WW 2 war production, government working with industry could win these oil wars.</p><p>
But this time with 10s of thousands of wind, solar, and biofuel plants and millions of hybrid plugin vehicles...instead of millions of jeeps, trucks, planes, ships, guns, bombs...</p><p>
American workers and factories could do it all again and the US manufacturing and tax base would be revitalized, providing good jobs once again for american families. &nbsp;The US would become an export leader of these oil and earth saving products.</p><p>
It's time for progressive politicians to throw caution to the wind (and sun) and take a chance. &nbsp;We are rapidly losing political power to the corporate shills, the neo-conservatives are planning never ending oil wars for global corporate empire. &nbsp;And their WMD and other lies are winning votes.</p><p>
There is no faithbased patriotism &nbsp;required to see that this new energy policy is truly patriotic, unlike these eternal oil wars and the terrorism that comes with them.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by brianbonlender</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 May 2005 06:09:37 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>re relation to Apollo Alliance<p>Apollo Alliance folks and Rep. Inslee coincidentally began working on the same idea, independently and at roughly the same time, using the exact same moniker (Apollo). &nbsp;The Apollo Alliance people came to us before getting their alliance off the ground when they found an op ed Inslee had published in the Seattle PI on the subject from December of '02 (<a href="http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/100516_inslee19.shtml?searchpagefrom=1&amp;searchdiff=883" rel="nofollow">http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/100516_inslee19.shtml?searchpagefrom=1&amp;searchdiff=883). &nbsp;We have worked with the Apollo Alliance, as well as many other organizations and clean energy industry experts in developing some of these ideas and concepts. &nbsp;<p>
Brian Bonlender<br>
Legislative Director<br>
Office of Congressman Jay Inslee</br></br></p></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>re relation to Apollo Alliance<p>Apollo Alliance folks and Rep. Inslee coincidentally began working on the same idea, independently and at roughly the same time, using the exact same moniker (Apollo). &nbsp;The Apollo Alliance people came to us before getting their alliance off the ground when they found an op ed Inslee had published in the Seattle PI on the subject from December of '02 (<a href="http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/100516_inslee19.shtml?searchpagefrom=1&amp;searchdiff=883" rel="nofollow">http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/100516_inslee19.shtml?searchpagefrom=1&amp;searchdiff=883). &nbsp;We have worked with the Apollo Alliance, as well as many other organizations and clean energy industry experts in developing some of these ideas and concepts. &nbsp;<p>
Brian Bonlender<br>
Legislative Director<br>
Office of Congressman Jay Inslee</br></br></p></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by brianbonlender</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 May 2005 06:55:21 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Government purchase of green energy products</strong></p><p>It seems that we both agree on the same goals here. &nbsp;Regarding the agressiveness of this bill, it is far more agressive than anything else put forward. &nbsp;It is truly a crash effort to deal with our energy situation.</p><p>
Rargarding your first specific concern, here's what it does to have the federal gov use its buying power:</p><p>
-Requires the federal government to purchase 10% of its electricity from renewable sources, such as solar and wind power, or other zero-emission sources by 2015.</p><p>
-Require that when the federal government purchases vehicles, 10% of those vehicles must be hybrids or vehicles that otherwise achieve 40 miles per gallon.</p><p>
-Provides interest free loans so that institutions of higher learning, municipalities and local governments can purchase hybrids or vehicles that can get 40 miles to the gallon.</p><p>
-Require the government to, where it is economically feasible, purchase biodiesel, 85% ethanol blended gasoline, or 10% ethanol blended gasoline.</p><p>
- The bill will also provide tax credits in order to incentivize consumer purchase of and industry production of hybrids, advanced diesels, alternative fuel and hydrogen vehicles.</p><p>
Brian Bonlender<br>
Legislative Director<br>
Congressman Jay Inslee<br>
</br></br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>Government purchase of green energy products</strong></p><p>It seems that we both agree on the same goals here. &nbsp;Regarding the agressiveness of this bill, it is far more agressive than anything else put forward. &nbsp;It is truly a crash effort to deal with our energy situation.</p><p>
Rargarding your first specific concern, here's what it does to have the federal gov use its buying power:</p><p>
-Requires the federal government to purchase 10% of its electricity from renewable sources, such as solar and wind power, or other zero-emission sources by 2015.</p><p>
-Require that when the federal government purchases vehicles, 10% of those vehicles must be hybrids or vehicles that otherwise achieve 40 miles per gallon.</p><p>
-Provides interest free loans so that institutions of higher learning, municipalities and local governments can purchase hybrids or vehicles that can get 40 miles to the gallon.</p><p>
-Require the government to, where it is economically feasible, purchase biodiesel, 85% ethanol blended gasoline, or 10% ethanol blended gasoline.</p><p>
- The bill will also provide tax credits in order to incentivize consumer purchase of and industry production of hybrids, advanced diesels, alternative fuel and hydrogen vehicles.</p><p>
Brian Bonlender<br>
Legislative Director<br>
Congressman Jay Inslee<br>
</br></br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 20 May 2005 05:14:12 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Re: Brian Bonlender</strong></p><p>Thanks for responding. &nbsp;My plan is the negotiating position of we the people, for want of any other. &nbsp;</p><p>
It is number 12 with a bullet in ratings on the moveon.org forum out of over 5000 comments.</p><p>
The Bush energy plan is the corporate neo-conservative energy monopoly negotiating position.</p><p>
So you come down in the middle? &nbsp;With only 10% purchase by government of green energy, and by 2015?</p><p>
That is not the middle. &nbsp;Go back to your corporate donors and tell them to give US more.</p><p>
We the people need an energy plan that eliminates imported oil by 2015, and ends these oil wars once and for all. &nbsp;This is as important as WW 2 war production was.</p><p>
Get serious about it! &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;thanks! &nbsp;</p>
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				<p><strong>Re: Brian Bonlender</strong></p><p>Thanks for responding. &nbsp;My plan is the negotiating position of we the people, for want of any other. &nbsp;</p><p>
It is number 12 with a bullet in ratings on the moveon.org forum out of over 5000 comments.</p><p>
The Bush energy plan is the corporate neo-conservative energy monopoly negotiating position.</p><p>
So you come down in the middle? &nbsp;With only 10% purchase by government of green energy, and by 2015?</p><p>
That is not the middle. &nbsp;Go back to your corporate donors and tell them to give US more.</p><p>
We the people need an energy plan that eliminates imported oil by 2015, and ends these oil wars once and for all. &nbsp;This is as important as WW 2 war production was.</p><p>
Get serious about it! &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;thanks! &nbsp;</p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Dyre42</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 25 May 2005 23:26:51 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>Re: Re: Brian Bonlender</strong></p><p>Amazingdrx the trick is to get the bill passed first and then change the numbers later. A 50% requirement on the govt wouldn't even need Delay to twist arms to shoot it down.</p>
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				<p><strong>Re: Re: Brian Bonlender</strong></p><p>Amazingdrx the trick is to get the bill passed first and then change the numbers later. A 50% requirement on the govt wouldn't even need Delay to twist arms to shoot it down.</p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 May 2005 21:40:22 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/inslee-apollo/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>Re: &quot;then change the numbers later&quot;</strong></p><p>Ahh riiight. &nbsp;It won't be like the other measures on the environment by bushco inc., like the clean air act.</p><p>
Once it is passed the numbers will be changed to really help get green energy going. &nbsp;</p><p>
And the McCain/Lieberman nuke cue lar power provision in that energy bill will be dropped too.</p><p>
We'll fool them right? Hehey. </p>
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				<p><strong>Re: &quot;then change the numbers later&quot;</strong></p><p>Ahh riiight. &nbsp;It won't be like the other measures on the environment by bushco inc., like the clean air act.</p><p>
Once it is passed the numbers will be changed to really help get green energy going. &nbsp;</p><p>
And the McCain/Lieberman nuke cue lar power provision in that energy bill will be dropped too.</p><p>
We'll fool them right? Hehey. </p>
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