<![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Who knew the stoic people of Minnesota were so advanced?]]> Grist Comment Feed en Comment #1 by planetthoughts http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Thu, 31 May 2007 20:23:30 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/1 80% reduction by 2050... is it enough?

I hope the 80% reduction of greenhouse gas emissions by 2050 is enough.  It seems that is the new gold standard for those who are really getting alarmed by global warming.  For example, the United Kingdom recently announced a very similar goal.

However, there is in parallel a good deal of news that seems to indicate that we need something more like an 80% reduction within 10 years.  Now, that is my own estimate, and I don't think there are well-agreed exact numbers, but look at the recent NASA report declaring that we have 10 years to make dramatic changes.  Honestly, I just don't know for sure what the timeline is... and it seems no one else is sure, but when you analyze by risk factors, it seems we need to move even faster in the right direction than Minnesota is doing.

Can we do it?  I don't know, it seems so unlikely.  But if there are some additional major climate events such as a large glacier disintegrating, perhaps we will put our foot to the gas pedal, excuse the expression.

I am in the somewhat doubtful but not hopeless camp.  The world will take some actions, and there will be some climate change despite that, as the change has already started and will certainly increase before there is improvement.  I will do what I can, and will work at it.  The rest is up to destiny.

David Alexander PlanetThoughts.org Love your Planet.

]]> 80% reduction by 2050... is it enough?

I hope the 80% reduction of greenhouse gas emissions by 2050 is enough.  It seems that is the new gold standard for those who are really getting alarmed by global warming.  For example, the United Kingdom recently announced a very similar goal.

However, there is in parallel a good deal of news that seems to indicate that we need something more like an 80% reduction within 10 years.  Now, that is my own estimate, and I don't think there are well-agreed exact numbers, but look at the recent NASA report declaring that we have 10 years to make dramatic changes.  Honestly, I just don't know for sure what the timeline is... and it seems no one else is sure, but when you analyze by risk factors, it seems we need to move even faster in the right direction than Minnesota is doing.

Can we do it?  I don't know, it seems so unlikely.  But if there are some additional major climate events such as a large glacier disintegrating, perhaps we will put our foot to the gas pedal, excuse the expression.

I am in the somewhat doubtful but not hopeless camp.  The world will take some actions, and there will be some climate change despite that, as the change has already started and will certainly increase before there is improvement.  I will do what I can, and will work at it.  The rest is up to destiny.

David Alexander PlanetThoughts.org Love your Planet.

]]> Comment #2 by Planner http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Thu, 31 May 2007 23:41:40 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/2 And while we're on the Minneapolis kick....

Who needs stinking, polluting moving vans? Not this guy: http://crccoffeebar.blogspot.com/2007/05/leave-moving-van ...
Upper midwest - yo!

]]> And while we're on the Minneapolis kick....

Who needs stinking, polluting moving vans? Not this guy: http://crccoffeebar.blogspot.com/2007/05/leave-moving-van ...
Upper midwest - yo!

]]> Comment #3 by Grevangelical http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 01:32:58 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/3 Yeah, that's my home

Although our wonderful governor ignored the environment completely his first term, maybe winning reelection by the closest margin of any Minnesotan governor in recent history helped. Well, that and having a House and Senate that are willing to overrule any veto on environmental issues.

One of the best parts of this bill is the complete ban on all future coal plants and the gradual (too gradual, I'll admit) phasing out of all current coal power. That and the efficiency standards make me very happy.

]]> Yeah, that's my home

Although our wonderful governor ignored the environment completely his first term, maybe winning reelection by the closest margin of any Minnesotan governor in recent history helped. Well, that and having a House and Senate that are willing to overrule any veto on environmental issues.

One of the best parts of this bill is the complete ban on all future coal plants and the gradual (too gradual, I'll admit) phasing out of all current coal power. That and the efficiency standards make me very happy.

]]> Comment #4 by Delay And Deny http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 01:37:12 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/4 Cancun of the North

Thanks to Global Heating, Minnesota will soon be a tropical paradise.

John Bailo, The "Denier Guy"
You Read It Here First

]]> Cancun of the North

Thanks to Global Heating, Minnesota will soon be a tropical paradise.

John Bailo, The "Denier Guy"
You Read It Here First

]]> Comment #5 by Grevangelical http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 02:03:45 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/5 Mr. Bailo, you are a silly man

Were you here last year with the incredibly high temperatures that reached over 110?F? If it hadn't been for the drought there would have been no relief at all, high humidity in places like Minnesota means that the temperature does not drop very much at night (greenhouse effect) and that means it can stay over 80?F for weeks without even dropping below at night. Minnesota will be dreadfully unpleasant if the average temperature increases another 3-6?C.

]]> Mr. Bailo, you are a silly man

Were you here last year with the incredibly high temperatures that reached over 110?F? If it hadn't been for the drought there would have been no relief at all, high humidity in places like Minnesota means that the temperature does not drop very much at night (greenhouse effect) and that means it can stay over 80?F for weeks without even dropping below at night. Minnesota will be dreadfully unpleasant if the average temperature increases another 3-6?C.

]]> Comment #6 by Grevangelical http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 02:05:32 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/6 Irritatingly enough Gristmill doesn't like degrees

]]> Irritatingly enough Gristmill doesn't like degrees

]]> Comment #7 by JMG http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 02:52:15 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/7 No, 80% is probably not enough

But any state willing to commit to 80% now will be in the best shape to adopt the more aggressive goal.  The 80% by 2050 is a watershed whether it's actually adequate or not---it's so far in the right direction that it's a complete rejection of business as usual.  The key is getting started on an aggressive program NOW, before we commit to an intolerable amount of warming.

Save the world: Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.

]]> No, 80% is probably not enough

But any state willing to commit to 80% now will be in the best shape to adopt the more aggressive goal.  The 80% by 2050 is a watershed whether it's actually adequate or not---it's so far in the right direction that it's a complete rejection of business as usual.  The key is getting started on an aggressive program NOW, before we commit to an intolerable amount of warming.

Save the world: Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.

]]> Comment #8 by Matt G http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 03:26:12 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/8 Re: is it enough?

I'm less hopeful than that.  I predict that we will pump more carbon into the air in 2027 than we do in 2007.  When you take this chart and add all of the additional coal plants we're building, we'd likely need to completely remove all vehicles just to stay even.  If our entire country committed to reduce our carbon by 80%, we'd need to completely remove coal plants and switch to electric vehicles.  That's just not going to happen in the near future, short of an obvious crisis like the oceans rising up and swallowing cities.

]]> Re: is it enough?

I'm less hopeful than that.  I predict that we will pump more carbon into the air in 2027 than we do in 2007.  When you take this chart and add all of the additional coal plants we're building, we'd likely need to completely remove all vehicles just to stay even.  If our entire country committed to reduce our carbon by 80%, we'd need to completely remove coal plants and switch to electric vehicles.  That's just not going to happen in the near future, short of an obvious crisis like the oceans rising up and swallowing cities.

]]> Comment #9 by JMG http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 03:36:18 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/9 Once again, I hear that voice

If our entire country committed to reduce our carbon by 80%, we'd need to completely remove coal plants and switch to electric vehicles.  That's just not going to happen in the near future, short of an obvious crisis like the oceans rising up and swallowing cities.

(Booming celestial voice heard everywhere):

"Your offer is accepted."

Save the world: Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.


]]> Once again, I hear that voice

If our entire country committed to reduce our carbon by 80%, we'd need to completely remove coal plants and switch to electric vehicles.  That's just not going to happen in the near future, short of an obvious crisis like the oceans rising up and swallowing cities.

(Booming celestial voice heard everywhere):

"Your offer is accepted."

Save the world: Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.


]]> Comment #10 by PBrazelton http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 03:36:55 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/10 "Tropical Paradise?"

I know your primary skill is 'talking from ass', but man, you should at least VISIT MN before talking about tropical paradises.  As Grevangelical points out, it's already insanely hot here in the summer.  I've lived in the deep south (Texas) and the heat there simply can't compare to the sweltering mess that descends on us more agressively year after year.  Trust me, MN is already a freaking tropical paradise for several months of the year and we'd rather not have any more.  Unless "mass heat deaths" amongst the poor, children and elderly is your idea of a true paradise.  And hey, with your track record, it could be.

]]> "Tropical Paradise?"

I know your primary skill is 'talking from ass', but man, you should at least VISIT MN before talking about tropical paradises.  As Grevangelical points out, it's already insanely hot here in the summer.  I've lived in the deep south (Texas) and the heat there simply can't compare to the sweltering mess that descends on us more agressively year after year.  Trust me, MN is already a freaking tropical paradise for several months of the year and we'd rather not have any more.  Unless "mass heat deaths" amongst the poor, children and elderly is your idea of a true paradise.  And hey, with your track record, it could be.

]]> Comment #11 by Delay And Deny http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 04:53:27 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/11 Sounds like a fluke


My climate model forecasts a lot more rain for MN this year.

Check out the current Minneapolis weather:

http://www.ask.com/weather/c?wcwid=20682&wdow=&ws ...

No need to panic -- nice warm summers, cooled by rain, melting ice in winter, moving into the mild 40's.

John Bailo, The "Denier Guy"
You Read It Here First


]]> Sounds like a fluke


My climate model forecasts a lot more rain for MN this year.

Check out the current Minneapolis weather:

http://www.ask.com/weather/c?wcwid=20682&wdow=&ws ...

No need to panic -- nice warm summers, cooled by rain, melting ice in winter, moving into the mild 40's.

John Bailo, The "Denier Guy"
You Read It Here First


]]> Comment #12 by Its GEtting Hot in Here http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 05:42:03 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/12 Minnesota goes Green - Don'tcha Know?

Well, before you move to Minnesota...you should go meet some of the people who are making change. I don't think there is a more engaged bunch of students than in Minnesota. People point to California and Vermont, but change doesn't just come from the coasts. Read about them here!
Does Minnesota Know How to Bring it? You Betcha!

Check out dispatches from the youth climate movement: http://www.itsgettinghotinhere.org/


]]> Minnesota goes Green - Don'tcha Know?

Well, before you move to Minnesota...you should go meet some of the people who are making change. I don't think there is a more engaged bunch of students than in Minnesota. People point to California and Vermont, but change doesn't just come from the coasts. Read about them here!
Does Minnesota Know How to Bring it? You Betcha!

Check out dispatches from the youth climate movement: http://www.itsgettinghotinhere.org/


]]> Comment #13 by PBrazelton http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/ Fri, 01 Jun 2007 06:42:41 -0700 http://www.grist.org/article/honey-pack-up-were-moving-to-minnesota/13 Whoa

It had never occurred to me that my hysterical fears over our increasingly warm and uncomfortable summers could have been allayed by referring to tomorrow's weather prediction!  This whole time I've been concerned with the impacts of global warming both here and abroad, but I totally forgot to see if it was going to rain on Saturday - and it is.  Now only if someone - anyone! - could get the news to the IPCC that the June 2nd weather forecast for Minnesota shows a high in the low to mid 70's and a 59% chance of precipitation we can finally be done with this global warming nonsense.

Touché, my good man, touché.  I bow to your brilliance.

]]> Whoa

It had never occurred to me that my hysterical fears over our increasingly warm and uncomfortable summers could have been allayed by referring to tomorrow's weather prediction!  This whole time I've been concerned with the impacts of global warming both here and abroad, but I totally forgot to see if it was going to rain on Saturday - and it is.  Now only if someone - anyone! - could get the news to the IPCC that the June 2nd weather forecast for Minnesota shows a high in the low to mid 70's and a 59% chance of precipitation we can finally be done with this global warming nonsense.

Touché, my good man, touché.  I bow to your brilliance.

]]>