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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Ethanol is suddenly all the rage in D.C. and Detroit]]></title>
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	<description>Grist Comment Feed</description>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Karen Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 06:03:50 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Biofuel is bad for Florida</strong></p><p>Could biofuels be a bonanza for Florida? &nbsp;NO</p><p>
Conservation of the state's natural resources is<br>
more essential and could be a bonanza for the state.</p><p>
Cellulosic biomass production would use excessive fertilizer<br>
fuel and water consumption as well as pesticides. </p><p>
Where does phosphate fertilizer come from to grow biofuel crops?<br>
Florida.</p><p>
There is no benefit to Florida after it has been stripmined<br>
to death. &nbsp;PSC of Saskatchewan, Canada, plans on strip mining<br>
100,463 acres in a large bend of the Suwannee River.<br>
Mosaic Co. plans on mining 21,000 &nbsp;acres &nbsp;on the Peace River.<br>
The Manson-Jenkins tract also represents the first of<br>
several proposed mines totaling 60,000 acres that<br>
could be permitted adjacent to Horse Creek on the<br>
Peace River.</p><p>
There is no benefit to destroying wetlands, poisoning the<br>
water or disturbing river systems.</p><p>
Switchgrass is a lowland wetland grass. Repeated<br>
harvesting will require massive amounts of fuel, fertilizer<br>
industry has depleted 16 feet of soil in the Everglades.</p><p>
The remaining soil will eventually &nbsp;disappear until there<br>
is nothing left but limerock. End of farming.</p><p>
Our state's soils should be preserved for food production <br>
not wasted on fueling the American car culture.<br>
</br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>Biofuel is bad for Florida</strong></p><p>Could biofuels be a bonanza for Florida? &nbsp;NO</p><p>
Conservation of the state's natural resources is<br>
more essential and could be a bonanza for the state.</p><p>
Cellulosic biomass production would use excessive fertilizer<br>
fuel and water consumption as well as pesticides. </p><p>
Where does phosphate fertilizer come from to grow biofuel crops?<br>
Florida.</p><p>
There is no benefit to Florida after it has been stripmined<br>
to death. &nbsp;PSC of Saskatchewan, Canada, plans on strip mining<br>
100,463 acres in a large bend of the Suwannee River.<br>
Mosaic Co. plans on mining 21,000 &nbsp;acres &nbsp;on the Peace River.<br>
The Manson-Jenkins tract also represents the first of<br>
several proposed mines totaling 60,000 acres that<br>
could be permitted adjacent to Horse Creek on the<br>
Peace River.</p><p>
There is no benefit to destroying wetlands, poisoning the<br>
water or disturbing river systems.</p><p>
Switchgrass is a lowland wetland grass. Repeated<br>
harvesting will require massive amounts of fuel, fertilizer<br>
industry has depleted 16 feet of soil in the Everglades.</p><p>
The remaining soil will eventually &nbsp;disappear until there<br>
is nothing left but limerock. End of farming.</p><p>
Our state's soils should be preserved for food production <br>
not wasted on fueling the American car culture.<br>
</br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Tom Philpott</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 07:30:39 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Thank you, Karen</strong></p><p>Excellent response. People need to tread carefully before assuming that agricultural-based products are "renewable." </p>
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				<p><strong>Thank you, Karen</strong></p><p>Excellent response. People need to tread carefully before assuming that agricultural-based products are "renewable." </p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by urimar</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 15:43:11 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>corn</strong></p><p>The most important reason for not using corn as a source of fule is the fact that we dont have enough soil and water in the world to produce food for the starving people of africa.<br>
</br></p>
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				<p><strong>corn</strong></p><p>The most important reason for not using corn as a source of fule is the fact that we dont have enough soil and water in the world to produce food for the starving people of africa.<br>
</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by steve s</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 16:05:13 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Biofuels can be GREAT for Florida!<p>In Karen Orr's posting, numerous concerns were listed as to growing biofuel crops in Florida. &nbsp;Hopefully, Karen and others can find some comfort that these issues are very much being addressed by Scientists, Bio-facility Engineers, Farmers, and Environmentalists in our State.<p>
The basic concept of our research and demonstration efforts is to use environmentally damaged marginal lands to grow biofuel crops through soil building via carbon sequestration and management. &nbsp;Examples could include mining sites (e.g., phosphate, coal, etc.) that after mining are largely considered wastelands. Biofuel examples are fast growing trees, sweet sorghum, sugarcane, soybeans for power plant use, ethanol and biodiesel production.<p>
Our efforts on phosphate mined lands are directly addressing Karen's concerns as we are conserving water use and using very little fertilizer (letting the catalytic effects of increased soil organic matter build fertility such as increasing available nitrogen levels). &nbsp;Environmentalists should also be encouraged that through our soil building efforts, about 50 species of native plants have now returned to pre-existing marginal lands we are using.<p>
Our bioenergy engineering test results are encouraging also. &nbsp;Besides the obvious greenhouse gas benefits of displacing fossil fuels, research indicates that using biofuels in power plants may reduce NOx (i.e., smog) emissions between 50% and 70% by using biogas in a boiler's reburn zone.<p>
While there is no guarantee that we will be successful, at least we are trying.<p>
We have a significant library of work efforts at the website <a href="http://www.treepower.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org<p>
Such as:<p>
<a href="http://www.treepower.org/soils/main.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/soils/main.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/soils/soilorganicmatter.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/soils/soilorganicmatter.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/habitat/main5.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/habitat/main5.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/waterquality/main.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/waterquality/main.html &nbsp;<p>
Steve</p></a></a></a></a></p></p></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Biofuels can be GREAT for Florida!<p>In Karen Orr's posting, numerous concerns were listed as to growing biofuel crops in Florida. &nbsp;Hopefully, Karen and others can find some comfort that these issues are very much being addressed by Scientists, Bio-facility Engineers, Farmers, and Environmentalists in our State.<p>
The basic concept of our research and demonstration efforts is to use environmentally damaged marginal lands to grow biofuel crops through soil building via carbon sequestration and management. &nbsp;Examples could include mining sites (e.g., phosphate, coal, etc.) that after mining are largely considered wastelands. Biofuel examples are fast growing trees, sweet sorghum, sugarcane, soybeans for power plant use, ethanol and biodiesel production.<p>
Our efforts on phosphate mined lands are directly addressing Karen's concerns as we are conserving water use and using very little fertilizer (letting the catalytic effects of increased soil organic matter build fertility such as increasing available nitrogen levels). &nbsp;Environmentalists should also be encouraged that through our soil building efforts, about 50 species of native plants have now returned to pre-existing marginal lands we are using.<p>
Our bioenergy engineering test results are encouraging also. &nbsp;Besides the obvious greenhouse gas benefits of displacing fossil fuels, research indicates that using biofuels in power plants may reduce NOx (i.e., smog) emissions between 50% and 70% by using biogas in a boiler's reburn zone.<p>
While there is no guarantee that we will be successful, at least we are trying.<p>
We have a significant library of work efforts at the website <a href="http://www.treepower.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org<p>
Such as:<p>
<a href="http://www.treepower.org/soils/main.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/soils/main.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/soils/soilorganicmatter.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/soils/soilorganicmatter.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/habitat/main5.html;" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/habitat/main5.html; <a href="http://www.treepower.org/waterquality/main.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.treepower.org/waterquality/main.html &nbsp;<p>
Steve</p></a></a></a></a></p></p></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by raverill</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 24 Feb 2006 19:57:38 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Ethanol? Maybe</strong></p><p>No Child Left Behind, Clear Skies, WMD's, etc. etc. ad nauseum. At this point, I believe everything out of the mouth of George Bush is smoke, mirrors, or snake oil. There's a sucker punch hidden somewhere in Dubya's born-again bio-fuel dog and pony show. He hasn't said a word about conservation, higher automobile mileage standards, urban mass-transit, inter-urban mass transit,(Amtrak is being left to die on the vine,)or any of the other energy ideas promoted since Jimmy Carter's sweater speech. <br>
George W. Bush was bred, born, and raised to be a shill for the "awl bidness". I don't believe for a second that anything has changed. &nbsp;</br></p>
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				<p><strong>Ethanol? Maybe</strong></p><p>No Child Left Behind, Clear Skies, WMD's, etc. etc. ad nauseum. At this point, I believe everything out of the mouth of George Bush is smoke, mirrors, or snake oil. There's a sucker punch hidden somewhere in Dubya's born-again bio-fuel dog and pony show. He hasn't said a word about conservation, higher automobile mileage standards, urban mass-transit, inter-urban mass transit,(Amtrak is being left to die on the vine,)or any of the other energy ideas promoted since Jimmy Carter's sweater speech. <br>
George W. Bush was bred, born, and raised to be a shill for the "awl bidness". I don't believe for a second that anything has changed. &nbsp;</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Peter B</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 25 Feb 2006 07:41:19 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>Corn Ethanol</strong></p><p>Can we not get North Americans into far smaller, less thirsty cars? That would do far more for the environment than any "alternative fuel". Even better, can we not begin to rebuild out rediculous society so that people live far closer to where they work, shop and play than they now do? Think what that would do for obesity, traffic jams, and the finances of Al Qaeda! </p>
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				<p><strong>Corn Ethanol</strong></p><p>Can we not get North Americans into far smaller, less thirsty cars? That would do far more for the environment than any "alternative fuel". Even better, can we not begin to rebuild out rediculous society so that people live far closer to where they work, shop and play than they now do? Think what that would do for obesity, traffic jams, and the finances of Al Qaeda! </p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by birdboy</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 25 Feb 2006 11:21:42 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>same old crap</strong></p><p>Bush spent 1 billion dollars on advertising campaigns to push his policies on gullible Americans, and then cut funding for alternative energy 'research', and wants to sell off public parks to developers to fund his oil war? This is public funded advertising, to give the appearance of doing something about a problem that couldn't be hidden any longer, despite efforts to disguise, mislead, and discourage people from wanting change.</p><p>
And what's worse? The fact that even if he did accidently get biofuels going, it might be a disaster for diversity, native landscapes, and poverty relief, as food markets compete with fuel markets to feed the American obsession with private transportation (Plan A).</p><p>
Surprised?</p>
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				<p><strong>same old crap</strong></p><p>Bush spent 1 billion dollars on advertising campaigns to push his policies on gullible Americans, and then cut funding for alternative energy 'research', and wants to sell off public parks to developers to fund his oil war? This is public funded advertising, to give the appearance of doing something about a problem that couldn't be hidden any longer, despite efforts to disguise, mislead, and discourage people from wanting change.</p><p>
And what's worse? The fact that even if he did accidently get biofuels going, it might be a disaster for diversity, native landscapes, and poverty relief, as food markets compete with fuel markets to feed the American obsession with private transportation (Plan A).</p><p>
Surprised?</p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by samvekemans</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 25 Feb 2006 11:33:38 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>What canada is up to<p>Hi, <br>
At the Canadian International Autoshow this past week, i saw the government of Canada had a big display and showing off all the most fuel efficient cars. It looks like the government is thinking on the right track.<p>
They had a big display all about Ethanol and what it is.<p>
Here's an press release i googled up.<p>
from <p>
<a href="http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/eep.cfm?attr=8" rel="nofollow">http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/eep.cfm?attr=8<p>
Government of Canada<br>
2005/50 <br>
July 6, 2005<p>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>
Five Ethanol Plants Receive $46 Million in Government of Canada Funding<br>
BRANTFORD, ONTARIO -- Canada's capacity to produce renewable transportation fuels is set for another substantial increase following the announcement of a second round of funding under the Government of Canada's Ethanol Expansion Program (EEP). The Government of Canada has allocated a further $46 million for the construction or expansion of five ethanol plants across Canada.<p>
The results of the competitive process were announced today by Agriculture and Agri-Food Minister Andy Mitchell, on behalf of the Government of Canada.<p>
The following companies are being allocated contributions under Round 2 of the EEP:<p>
Commercial Alcohols Inc. -- $15 million for a new plant in Windsor, Ontario; <br>
Husky Oil Marketing Company -- $10.4 million to build a plant in Minnedosa, Manitoba; <br>
Integrated Grain Processors Co-Operative Inc. -- $11.9 million for a new plant in Brantford, Ontario; <br>
Permolex Ltd. -- $1.1 million to expand its existing facility in Red Deer, Alberta. <br>
Power Stream Energy Services Inc. -- $7.3 million to convert a recently closed starch plant in Collingwood, Ontario; and <br>
These contributions are in addition to $72 million that was previously allocated to six other projects under the first round of the Ethanol Expansion Program.<p>
<strong>**<p>
I got a hunch that Canadian farmers will want to produce a whole wack of it... and be exporting it down south... <p>
... aparently here too there are a few stations around... and more will come. ... a couple in Ontario<p>
<a href="http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/stations-results.cfm?prov=ON&amp;attr=16" rel="nofollow">http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/stations-results.cfm?prov=ON&amp;attr=16<p>
FYI<br>
:)<br>
</br></br></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p></br></br></br></br></br></p></p></p></br></p></p></br></br></p></a></p></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>What canada is up to<p>Hi, <br>
At the Canadian International Autoshow this past week, i saw the government of Canada had a big display and showing off all the most fuel efficient cars. It looks like the government is thinking on the right track.<p>
They had a big display all about Ethanol and what it is.<p>
Here's an press release i googled up.<p>
from <p>
<a href="http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/eep.cfm?attr=8" rel="nofollow">http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/eep.cfm?attr=8<p>
Government of Canada<br>
2005/50 <br>
July 6, 2005<p>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>
Five Ethanol Plants Receive $46 Million in Government of Canada Funding<br>
BRANTFORD, ONTARIO -- Canada's capacity to produce renewable transportation fuels is set for another substantial increase following the announcement of a second round of funding under the Government of Canada's Ethanol Expansion Program (EEP). The Government of Canada has allocated a further $46 million for the construction or expansion of five ethanol plants across Canada.<p>
The results of the competitive process were announced today by Agriculture and Agri-Food Minister Andy Mitchell, on behalf of the Government of Canada.<p>
The following companies are being allocated contributions under Round 2 of the EEP:<p>
Commercial Alcohols Inc. -- $15 million for a new plant in Windsor, Ontario; <br>
Husky Oil Marketing Company -- $10.4 million to build a plant in Minnedosa, Manitoba; <br>
Integrated Grain Processors Co-Operative Inc. -- $11.9 million for a new plant in Brantford, Ontario; <br>
Permolex Ltd. -- $1.1 million to expand its existing facility in Red Deer, Alberta. <br>
Power Stream Energy Services Inc. -- $7.3 million to convert a recently closed starch plant in Collingwood, Ontario; and <br>
These contributions are in addition to $72 million that was previously allocated to six other projects under the first round of the Ethanol Expansion Program.<p>
<strong>**<p>
I got a hunch that Canadian farmers will want to produce a whole wack of it... and be exporting it down south... <p>
... aparently here too there are a few stations around... and more will come. ... a couple in Ontario<p>
<a href="http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/stations-results.cfm?prov=ON&amp;attr=16" rel="nofollow">http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/fuels/ethanol/stations-results.cfm?prov=ON&amp;attr=16<p>
FYI<br>
:)<br>
</br></br></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p></br></br></br></br></br></p></p></p></br></p></p></br></br></p></a></p></p></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by Karen Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 26 Feb 2006 04:12:44 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>The adoption of biofuels would be a disaster<p>Y'all,<p>
Perhaps you'll find these two articles by George Monbiot of interest. &nbsp;You can find his references by clicking the links beneath each article.<br>
Energy Justice also has much information on biodiesel. &nbsp;See <a href="http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html &nbsp;<p>
Karen Orr<p>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>
By promoting biodiesel &nbsp;a market for the most destructive crop on earth is created. We must reduce demand, not alter supply to allow greenwashed motorists to feel better about themselves.<p>
Trying to meet a rising demand for fuel is madness, wherever the fuel might come from. The hard decisions have been avoided, and another portion of the biosphere is going up in smoke.<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-<br>
They will cross their fingers and place their faith in a series of technofixes, some of which work, and some of which cause more problems than they solve. They will study the potential of "clean coal", which so far remains an oxymoron, and accelarate the burial of carbon dioxide, which might or might not stay where it's put. They will promote "carbon offsets" (you pay someone else to annul your sins by planting trees or building hydroelectric dams) which have so far been a disastrous failure.(8) They will encourage the development of hydrogen fuel cells, which do not produce energy but use it, and the production of biofuels, which will set up a competition for arable land between cars and people, exacerbating the famines climate change is likely to cause.<br>
Tell people something they know already,<br>
and they will thank you for it. Tell them<br>
something new, and they will hate you for it.<br>
Feeding Cars, Not People<p>
The adoption of biofuels would be a humanitarian and environmental disaster<p>
By George Monbiot. Published in the Guardian 22nd November 2004<p>
If human beings were without sin, we would still live in an imperfect world. Adam Smith's notion that by pursuing his own interest a man "frequently promotes that of ... society more effectually than when he really intends to promote it" and Karl Marx's picture of a society in which "the free development of each is the condition for the free development of all" are both mocked by one obvious constraint. The world is finite. This means that when one group of people pursues its own interests, it damages the interests of others.<p>
It is hard to think of a better example than the current enthusiasm for "biofuels". Biofuels are made from plant oils or crop wastes or wood, and can be used to run cars and buses and lorries. Burning them simply returns to the atmosphere the carbon which the plants extracted while they were growing. So switching from fossil fuels to biodiesel and bio-alcohol is now being promoted as the solution to climate change.<p>
Next month the British government will have to set a target for the amount of transport fuel that will come from crops. The European Union wants 2% of the oil we use to be biodiesel by the end of next year, rising to 6% by 2010 and 20% by 2020.(1) To try to meet these targets, the government has reduced the tax on biofuels by 20 pence a litre, while the EU is paying farmers an extra 45 euros a hectare to grow them.<p>
Everyone seems happy about this. The farmers and the chemicals industry can develop new markets, the government can meet its commitments to cut carbon emissions, and environmentalists can celebrate the fact that plant fuels reduce local pollution as well as global warming. Unlike hydrogen fuel cells, biofuels can be deployed straight away. This in fact was how Rudolf Diesel expected his invention to be used. When he demonstrated his engine at the World Show in 1900, he ran it on peanut oil. "The use of vegetable oils for engine fuels may seem insignificant today," he predicted. "But such oils may become in course of time as important as petroleum."(2) Some enthusiasts are predicting that if fossil fuel prices continue to rise, he will soon be proved right.<p>
I hope not. Those who have been promoting these fuels are well-intentioned, but wrong. They are wrong because the world is finite. If biofuels take off, they will cause a global humanitarian disaster.<p>
Used as they are today, on a very small scale, they do no harm. A few thousand greens in the United Kingdom are running their cars on used chip fat. But recycled cooking oils could supply only 100,000 tonnes of diesel a year in this country,(3) equivalent to one 380th of our road transport fuel.<p>
It might also be possible to turn crop wastes such as wheat stubble into alcohol for use in cars - the Observer ran an article about this on Sunday.(4) I'd like to see the figures, but I find it hard to believe that we will be able to extract more energy than we use in transporting and processing straw. But the EU's plans, like those of all the enthusiasts for bio-locomotion, depend on growing crops specifically for fuel. As soon as you examine the implications, you discover that the cure is as bad as the disease.<p>
Road transport in the United Kingdom consumes 37.6 million tonnes of petroleum products a year.(5) The most productive oil crop which can be grown in this country is rape. The average yield is between 3 and 3.5 tonnes per hectare.(6) One tonne of rapeseed produces 415 kilos of biodiesel.(7) So every hectare of arable land could provide 1.45 tonnes of transport fuel.<p>
To run our cars and buses and lorries on biodiesel, in other words, would require 25.9m hectares. There are 5.7m in the United Kingdom.(8) Switching to green fuels requires four and half times our arable area. Even the EU's more modest target of 20% by 2020 would consume almost all our cropland.<p>
If the same thing is to happen all over Europe, the impact on global food supply will be catastrophic: big enough to tip the global balance from net surplus to net deficit. If, as some environmentalists demand, it is to happen worldwide, then most of the arable surface of the planet will be deployed to produce food for cars, not people.<p>
This prospect sounds, at first, ridiculous. Surely if there was unmet demand for food, the market would ensure that crops were used to feed people rather than vehicles? There is no basis for this assumption. The market responds to money, not need. People who own cars have more money than people at risk of starvation. In a contest between their demand for fuel and poor people's demand for food, the car-owners win every time. Something very much like this is happening already. Though 800 million people are permanently malnourished, the global increase in crop production is being used to feed animals: the number of livestock on earth has quintupled since 1950.(9) The reason is that those who buy meat and dairy products have more purchasing power than those who buy only subsistence crops.<p>
Green fuel is not just a humanitarian disaster; it is also an environmental disaster. Those who worry about the scale and intensity of today's agriculture should consider what farming will look like when it is run by the oil industry. Moreover, if we try to develop a market for rapeseed biodiesel in Europe it will immediately develop into a market for palm oil and soya oil. Oilpalm can produce four times as much biodiesel per hectare as rape, and it is grown in places where labour is cheap. Planting it is already one of the world's major causes of tropical forest destruction. Soya has a lower oil yield than rape, but the oil is a by-product of the manufacture of animal feed. A new market for it will stimulate an industry which has already destroyed most of Brazil's cerrado (one of the world's most biodiverse environments) and much of its rainforest.<p>
It is shocking to see how narrow the focus of some environmentalists can be. At a meeting in Paris last month, a group of scientists and greens studying abrupt climate change decided that Tony Blair's two big ideas - tackling global warming and helping Africa - could both be met by turning Africa into a biofuel production zone. This strategy, according to its convenor, "provides a sustainable development path for the many African countries that can produce biofuels cheaply".(10) I know the definition of sustainable development has been changing, but I wasn't aware that it now encompasses mass starvation and the eradication of tropical forests. Last year the British parliamentary committee on environment, food and rural affairs, which is supposed to specialise in joined-up thinking, examined every possible consequence of biofuel production - from rural incomes to skylark numbers - except the impact on food supply.(11)<p>
We need a solution to the global warming caused by cars, but this isn't it. If the production of biofuels is big enough to affect climate change, it will be big enough to cause global starvation.<p>
<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------<p>
Biodiesel enthusiasts have accidentally invented the most carbon-intensive fuel on earth<p>
By George Monbiot. Published in the Guardian 6th December 2005<p>
Over the past two years I have made an uncomfortable discovery. Like most environmentalists, I have been as blind to the constraints affecting our energy supply as my opponents have been to climate change. I now realise that I have entertained a belief in magic.<p>
In 2003, the biologist Jeffrey Dukes calculated that the fossil fuels we burn in one year were made from organic matter "containing 44&#215;10 to the 18 grams of carbon, which is more than 400 times the net primary productivity of the planet's current biota."(1) In plain English, this means that every year we use four centuries' worth of plants and animals.<p>
The idea that we can simply replace this fossil legacy - and the extraordinary power densities it gives us - with ambient energy is the stuff of science fiction. There is simply no substitute for cutting back. But substitutes are being sought everywhere. They are being promoted today at the climate talks in Montreal, by states - such as ours - which seek to avoid the hard decisions climate change demands. And at least one of them is worse than the fossil fuel burning it replaces.<p>
The last time I drew attention to the hazards of making diesel fuel from vegetable oils, I received as much abuse as I have ever been sent by the supporters of the Iraq war. The biodiesel missionaries, I discovered, are as vociferous in their denial as the executives of Exxon. I am now prepared to admit that my previous column was wrong. But they're not going to like it. I was wrong because I underestimated the fuel's destructive impact.<p>
Before I go any further, I should make it clear that turning used chip fat into motor fuel is a good thing. The people slithering around all day in vats of filth are perfoming a service to society. But there is enough waste cooking oil in the UK to meet one 380th of our demand for road transport fuel(2). Beyond that, the trouble begins.<p>
When I wrote about it last year, I thought that the biggest problem caused by biodiesel was that it set up a competition for land(3). Arable land that would otherwise have been used to grow food would instead be used to grow fuel. But now I find that something even worse is happening. The biodiesel industry has accidentally invented the world's most carbon-intensive fuel.<p>
In promoting biodiesel - as the European Union, the British and US governments and thousands of environmental campaigners do - you might imagine that you are creating a market for old chip fat, or rapeseed oil, or oil from algae grown in desert ponds. In reality you are creating a market for the most destructive crop on earth.<p>
Last week, the chairman of Malaysia's Federal Land Development Authority announced that he was about to build a new biodiesel plant(4). His was the ninth such decision in four months. Four new refineries are being built in Peninsula Malaysia, one in Sarawak and two in Rotterdam(5). Two foreign consortia - one German, one American - are setting up rival plants in Singapore(6). All of them will be making biodiesel from the same source: oil from palm trees.<p>
"The demand for biodiesel," the Malaysian Star reports, "will come from the European Community ... This fresh demand ... would, at the very least, take up most of Malaysia's crude palm oil inventories"(7). Why? Because it's cheaper than biodiesel made from any other crop.<p>
In September, Friends of the Earth published a report about the impacts of palm oil production. "Between 1985 and 2000," it found, "the development of oil-palm plantations was responsible for an estimated 87 per cent of deforestation in Malaysia"(8). In Sumatra and Borneo, some 4 million hectares of forest has been converted to palm farms. Now a further 6 million hectares is scheduled for clearance in Malaysia, and 16.5m in Indonesia.<p>
Almost all the remaining forest is at risk. Even the famous Tanjung Puting National Park in Kalimantan is being ripped apart by oil planters. The orang-utan is likely to become extinct in the wild. Sumatran rhinos, tigers, gibbons, tapirs, proboscis monkeys and thousands of other species could go the same way. Thousands of indigenous people have been evicted from their lands, and some 500 Indonesians have been tortured when they tried to resist(9). The forest fires which every so often smother the region in smog are mostly started by the palm growers. The entire region is being turned into a gigantic vegetable oil field.<p>
Before oil palms, which are small and scrubby, are planted, vast forest trees, containing a much greater store of carbon, must be felled and burnt. Having used up the drier lands, the plantations are now moving into the swamp forests, which grow on peat. When they've cut the trees, the planters drain the ground. As the peat dries it oxidises, releasing even more carbon dioxide than the trees. In terms of its impact on both the local and global environments, palm biodiesel is more destructive than crude oil from Nigeria.<p>
The British government understands this. In the report it published last month, when it announced that it will obey the European Union and ensure that 5.75% of our transport fuel comes from plants by 2010, it admitted that "the main environmental risks are likely to be those concerning any large expansion in biofuel feedstock production, and particularly in Brazil (for sugar cane) and South East Asia (for palm oil plantations)."(10) It suggested that the best means of dealing with the problem was to prevent environmentally destructive fuels from being imported. The government asked its consultants whether a ban would infringe world trade rules. The answer was yes: "mandatory environmental criteria ... would greatly increase the risk of international legal challenge to the policy as a whole"(11). So it dropped the idea of banning imports, and called for "some form of voluntary scheme" instead(12). Knowing that the creation of this market will lead to a massive surge in imports of palm oil, knowing that there is nothing meaningful it can do to prevent them, and knowing that they will accelarate rather than ameliorate climate change, the government has decided to go ahead anyway.<p>
At other times it happily defies the European Union. But what the EU wants and what the government wants are the same. "It is essential that we balance the increasing demand for travel," the government's report says, "with our goals for protecting the environment"(13). Until recently, we had a policy of reducing the demand for travel. Now, though no announcement has been made, that policy has gone. Like the Tories in the early 1990s, the Labour administration seeks to accommodate demand, however high it rises. Figures obtained last week by the campaigning group Road Block show that for the widening of the M1 alone the government will pay &#163;3.6 billion - more than it is spending on its entire climate change programme(14). Instead of attempting to reduce demand, it is trying to alter supply. It is prepared to sacrifice the South East Asian rainforests in order to be seen to do something, and to allow motorists to feel better about themselves.<p>
All this illustrates the futility of the technofixes now being pursued in Montreal. Trying to meet a rising demand for fuel is madness, wherever the fuel might come from. The hard decisions have been avoided, and another portion of the biosphere is going up in smoke.<p>
<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></br></br></br></br></br></p></p></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>The adoption of biofuels would be a disaster<p>Y'all,<p>
Perhaps you'll find these two articles by George Monbiot of interest. &nbsp;You can find his references by clicking the links beneath each article.<br>
Energy Justice also has much information on biodiesel. &nbsp;See <a href="http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html &nbsp;<p>
Karen Orr<p>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<p>
By promoting biodiesel &nbsp;a market for the most destructive crop on earth is created. We must reduce demand, not alter supply to allow greenwashed motorists to feel better about themselves.<p>
Trying to meet a rising demand for fuel is madness, wherever the fuel might come from. The hard decisions have been avoided, and another portion of the biosphere is going up in smoke.<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-<br>
They will cross their fingers and place their faith in a series of technofixes, some of which work, and some of which cause more problems than they solve. They will study the potential of "clean coal", which so far remains an oxymoron, and accelarate the burial of carbon dioxide, which might or might not stay where it's put. They will promote "carbon offsets" (you pay someone else to annul your sins by planting trees or building hydroelectric dams) which have so far been a disastrous failure.(8) They will encourage the development of hydrogen fuel cells, which do not produce energy but use it, and the production of biofuels, which will set up a competition for arable land between cars and people, exacerbating the famines climate change is likely to cause.<br>
Tell people something they know already,<br>
and they will thank you for it. Tell them<br>
something new, and they will hate you for it.<br>
Feeding Cars, Not People<p>
The adoption of biofuels would be a humanitarian and environmental disaster<p>
By George Monbiot. Published in the Guardian 22nd November 2004<p>
If human beings were without sin, we would still live in an imperfect world. Adam Smith's notion that by pursuing his own interest a man "frequently promotes that of ... society more effectually than when he really intends to promote it" and Karl Marx's picture of a society in which "the free development of each is the condition for the free development of all" are both mocked by one obvious constraint. The world is finite. This means that when one group of people pursues its own interests, it damages the interests of others.<p>
It is hard to think of a better example than the current enthusiasm for "biofuels". Biofuels are made from plant oils or crop wastes or wood, and can be used to run cars and buses and lorries. Burning them simply returns to the atmosphere the carbon which the plants extracted while they were growing. So switching from fossil fuels to biodiesel and bio-alcohol is now being promoted as the solution to climate change.<p>
Next month the British government will have to set a target for the amount of transport fuel that will come from crops. The European Union wants 2% of the oil we use to be biodiesel by the end of next year, rising to 6% by 2010 and 20% by 2020.(1) To try to meet these targets, the government has reduced the tax on biofuels by 20 pence a litre, while the EU is paying farmers an extra 45 euros a hectare to grow them.<p>
Everyone seems happy about this. The farmers and the chemicals industry can develop new markets, the government can meet its commitments to cut carbon emissions, and environmentalists can celebrate the fact that plant fuels reduce local pollution as well as global warming. Unlike hydrogen fuel cells, biofuels can be deployed straight away. This in fact was how Rudolf Diesel expected his invention to be used. When he demonstrated his engine at the World Show in 1900, he ran it on peanut oil. "The use of vegetable oils for engine fuels may seem insignificant today," he predicted. "But such oils may become in course of time as important as petroleum."(2) Some enthusiasts are predicting that if fossil fuel prices continue to rise, he will soon be proved right.<p>
I hope not. Those who have been promoting these fuels are well-intentioned, but wrong. They are wrong because the world is finite. If biofuels take off, they will cause a global humanitarian disaster.<p>
Used as they are today, on a very small scale, they do no harm. A few thousand greens in the United Kingdom are running their cars on used chip fat. But recycled cooking oils could supply only 100,000 tonnes of diesel a year in this country,(3) equivalent to one 380th of our road transport fuel.<p>
It might also be possible to turn crop wastes such as wheat stubble into alcohol for use in cars - the Observer ran an article about this on Sunday.(4) I'd like to see the figures, but I find it hard to believe that we will be able to extract more energy than we use in transporting and processing straw. But the EU's plans, like those of all the enthusiasts for bio-locomotion, depend on growing crops specifically for fuel. As soon as you examine the implications, you discover that the cure is as bad as the disease.<p>
Road transport in the United Kingdom consumes 37.6 million tonnes of petroleum products a year.(5) The most productive oil crop which can be grown in this country is rape. The average yield is between 3 and 3.5 tonnes per hectare.(6) One tonne of rapeseed produces 415 kilos of biodiesel.(7) So every hectare of arable land could provide 1.45 tonnes of transport fuel.<p>
To run our cars and buses and lorries on biodiesel, in other words, would require 25.9m hectares. There are 5.7m in the United Kingdom.(8) Switching to green fuels requires four and half times our arable area. Even the EU's more modest target of 20% by 2020 would consume almost all our cropland.<p>
If the same thing is to happen all over Europe, the impact on global food supply will be catastrophic: big enough to tip the global balance from net surplus to net deficit. If, as some environmentalists demand, it is to happen worldwide, then most of the arable surface of the planet will be deployed to produce food for cars, not people.<p>
This prospect sounds, at first, ridiculous. Surely if there was unmet demand for food, the market would ensure that crops were used to feed people rather than vehicles? There is no basis for this assumption. The market responds to money, not need. People who own cars have more money than people at risk of starvation. In a contest between their demand for fuel and poor people's demand for food, the car-owners win every time. Something very much like this is happening already. Though 800 million people are permanently malnourished, the global increase in crop production is being used to feed animals: the number of livestock on earth has quintupled since 1950.(9) The reason is that those who buy meat and dairy products have more purchasing power than those who buy only subsistence crops.<p>
Green fuel is not just a humanitarian disaster; it is also an environmental disaster. Those who worry about the scale and intensity of today's agriculture should consider what farming will look like when it is run by the oil industry. Moreover, if we try to develop a market for rapeseed biodiesel in Europe it will immediately develop into a market for palm oil and soya oil. Oilpalm can produce four times as much biodiesel per hectare as rape, and it is grown in places where labour is cheap. Planting it is already one of the world's major causes of tropical forest destruction. Soya has a lower oil yield than rape, but the oil is a by-product of the manufacture of animal feed. A new market for it will stimulate an industry which has already destroyed most of Brazil's cerrado (one of the world's most biodiverse environments) and much of its rainforest.<p>
It is shocking to see how narrow the focus of some environmentalists can be. At a meeting in Paris last month, a group of scientists and greens studying abrupt climate change decided that Tony Blair's two big ideas - tackling global warming and helping Africa - could both be met by turning Africa into a biofuel production zone. This strategy, according to its convenor, "provides a sustainable development path for the many African countries that can produce biofuels cheaply".(10) I know the definition of sustainable development has been changing, but I wasn't aware that it now encompasses mass starvation and the eradication of tropical forests. Last year the British parliamentary committee on environment, food and rural affairs, which is supposed to specialise in joined-up thinking, examined every possible consequence of biofuel production - from rural incomes to skylark numbers - except the impact on food supply.(11)<p>
We need a solution to the global warming caused by cars, but this isn't it. If the production of biofuels is big enough to affect climate change, it will be big enough to cause global starvation.<p>
<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------<p>
Biodiesel enthusiasts have accidentally invented the most carbon-intensive fuel on earth<p>
By George Monbiot. Published in the Guardian 6th December 2005<p>
Over the past two years I have made an uncomfortable discovery. Like most environmentalists, I have been as blind to the constraints affecting our energy supply as my opponents have been to climate change. I now realise that I have entertained a belief in magic.<p>
In 2003, the biologist Jeffrey Dukes calculated that the fossil fuels we burn in one year were made from organic matter "containing 44&#215;10 to the 18 grams of carbon, which is more than 400 times the net primary productivity of the planet's current biota."(1) In plain English, this means that every year we use four centuries' worth of plants and animals.<p>
The idea that we can simply replace this fossil legacy - and the extraordinary power densities it gives us - with ambient energy is the stuff of science fiction. There is simply no substitute for cutting back. But substitutes are being sought everywhere. They are being promoted today at the climate talks in Montreal, by states - such as ours - which seek to avoid the hard decisions climate change demands. And at least one of them is worse than the fossil fuel burning it replaces.<p>
The last time I drew attention to the hazards of making diesel fuel from vegetable oils, I received as much abuse as I have ever been sent by the supporters of the Iraq war. The biodiesel missionaries, I discovered, are as vociferous in their denial as the executives of Exxon. I am now prepared to admit that my previous column was wrong. But they're not going to like it. I was wrong because I underestimated the fuel's destructive impact.<p>
Before I go any further, I should make it clear that turning used chip fat into motor fuel is a good thing. The people slithering around all day in vats of filth are perfoming a service to society. But there is enough waste cooking oil in the UK to meet one 380th of our demand for road transport fuel(2). Beyond that, the trouble begins.<p>
When I wrote about it last year, I thought that the biggest problem caused by biodiesel was that it set up a competition for land(3). Arable land that would otherwise have been used to grow food would instead be used to grow fuel. But now I find that something even worse is happening. The biodiesel industry has accidentally invented the world's most carbon-intensive fuel.<p>
In promoting biodiesel - as the European Union, the British and US governments and thousands of environmental campaigners do - you might imagine that you are creating a market for old chip fat, or rapeseed oil, or oil from algae grown in desert ponds. In reality you are creating a market for the most destructive crop on earth.<p>
Last week, the chairman of Malaysia's Federal Land Development Authority announced that he was about to build a new biodiesel plant(4). His was the ninth such decision in four months. Four new refineries are being built in Peninsula Malaysia, one in Sarawak and two in Rotterdam(5). Two foreign consortia - one German, one American - are setting up rival plants in Singapore(6). All of them will be making biodiesel from the same source: oil from palm trees.<p>
"The demand for biodiesel," the Malaysian Star reports, "will come from the European Community ... This fresh demand ... would, at the very least, take up most of Malaysia's crude palm oil inventories"(7). Why? Because it's cheaper than biodiesel made from any other crop.<p>
In September, Friends of the Earth published a report about the impacts of palm oil production. "Between 1985 and 2000," it found, "the development of oil-palm plantations was responsible for an estimated 87 per cent of deforestation in Malaysia"(8). In Sumatra and Borneo, some 4 million hectares of forest has been converted to palm farms. Now a further 6 million hectares is scheduled for clearance in Malaysia, and 16.5m in Indonesia.<p>
Almost all the remaining forest is at risk. Even the famous Tanjung Puting National Park in Kalimantan is being ripped apart by oil planters. The orang-utan is likely to become extinct in the wild. Sumatran rhinos, tigers, gibbons, tapirs, proboscis monkeys and thousands of other species could go the same way. Thousands of indigenous people have been evicted from their lands, and some 500 Indonesians have been tortured when they tried to resist(9). The forest fires which every so often smother the region in smog are mostly started by the palm growers. The entire region is being turned into a gigantic vegetable oil field.<p>
Before oil palms, which are small and scrubby, are planted, vast forest trees, containing a much greater store of carbon, must be felled and burnt. Having used up the drier lands, the plantations are now moving into the swamp forests, which grow on peat. When they've cut the trees, the planters drain the ground. As the peat dries it oxidises, releasing even more carbon dioxide than the trees. In terms of its impact on both the local and global environments, palm biodiesel is more destructive than crude oil from Nigeria.<p>
The British government understands this. In the report it published last month, when it announced that it will obey the European Union and ensure that 5.75% of our transport fuel comes from plants by 2010, it admitted that "the main environmental risks are likely to be those concerning any large expansion in biofuel feedstock production, and particularly in Brazil (for sugar cane) and South East Asia (for palm oil plantations)."(10) It suggested that the best means of dealing with the problem was to prevent environmentally destructive fuels from being imported. The government asked its consultants whether a ban would infringe world trade rules. The answer was yes: "mandatory environmental criteria ... would greatly increase the risk of international legal challenge to the policy as a whole"(11). So it dropped the idea of banning imports, and called for "some form of voluntary scheme" instead(12). Knowing that the creation of this market will lead to a massive surge in imports of palm oil, knowing that there is nothing meaningful it can do to prevent them, and knowing that they will accelarate rather than ameliorate climate change, the government has decided to go ahead anyway.<p>
At other times it happily defies the European Union. But what the EU wants and what the government wants are the same. "It is essential that we balance the increasing demand for travel," the government's report says, "with our goals for protecting the environment"(13). Until recently, we had a policy of reducing the demand for travel. Now, though no announcement has been made, that policy has gone. Like the Tories in the early 1990s, the Labour administration seeks to accommodate demand, however high it rises. Figures obtained last week by the campaigning group Road Block show that for the widening of the M1 alone the government will pay &#163;3.6 billion - more than it is spending on its entire climate change programme(14). Instead of attempting to reduce demand, it is trying to alter supply. It is prepared to sacrifice the South East Asian rainforests in order to be seen to do something, and to allow motorists to feel better about themselves.<p>
All this illustrates the futility of the technofixes now being pursued in Montreal. Trying to meet a rising demand for fuel is madness, wherever the fuel might come from. The hard decisions have been avoided, and another portion of the biosphere is going up in smoke.<p>
<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></br></br></br></br></br></br></p></p></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by jdhlax</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 26 Feb 2006 05:03:36 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>Karen Is Right!</strong></p><p>I'm so glad to see that at least some people actually get it. &nbsp;Eliminating the environmental harms caused by driving will not be accomplished by technology, though the latter might mitigate some of those harms. &nbsp;For the umpteenth time, there are no magical solutions. &nbsp;For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, period. &nbsp;Just the building of roads is very environmentally destructive: compaction of soil, paving over the Earth, fragmentation of wildlife habitat, killing of plants and everything below the pavement, etc. &nbsp;To the extent, that we choose to live in harmony with nature, we will avoid causing destruction. &nbsp;To the extent that we do otherwise, we destroy life.</p>
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				<p><strong>Karen Is Right!</strong></p><p>I'm so glad to see that at least some people actually get it. &nbsp;Eliminating the environmental harms caused by driving will not be accomplished by technology, though the latter might mitigate some of those harms. &nbsp;For the umpteenth time, there are no magical solutions. &nbsp;For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, period. &nbsp;Just the building of roads is very environmentally destructive: compaction of soil, paving over the Earth, fragmentation of wildlife habitat, killing of plants and everything below the pavement, etc. &nbsp;To the extent, that we choose to live in harmony with nature, we will avoid causing destruction. &nbsp;To the extent that we do otherwise, we destroy life.</p>
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            <title>Comment #11 by Bob from ALAMN</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 27 Feb 2006 01:07:36 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/11</guid>
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				<p><strong>American Lung Association of MN supports E85<p>...because it is cleaner burning than gasoline.<p>
Perfect fuel? No.<p>
Better and cleaner burning than gasoline? Yes.<p>
Practical and available today? Yes.<p>
Minnesota drivers use more biofuel than any other state. We have more E85 pumps (200!), the nation's only biodiesel mandate and our biofuel program is growing.<p>
The American Lung Association of Minnesota strongly supports this effort. See more at our dedicated website:<p>
<a href="http://www.CleanAirChoice.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.CleanAirChoice.org</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>American Lung Association of MN supports E85<p>...because it is cleaner burning than gasoline.<p>
Perfect fuel? No.<p>
Better and cleaner burning than gasoline? Yes.<p>
Practical and available today? Yes.<p>
Minnesota drivers use more biofuel than any other state. We have more E85 pumps (200!), the nation's only biodiesel mandate and our biofuel program is growing.<p>
The American Lung Association of Minnesota strongly supports this effort. See more at our dedicated website:<p>
<a href="http://www.CleanAirChoice.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.CleanAirChoice.org</a></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by birdboy</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 27 Feb 2006 03:40:39 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/12</guid>
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				<p><strong>kill the car and save the planet</strong></p><p>Thanks, Karen, for clearly stating what should be obvious to anyone who values wilderness and also wants to feed all of humanity. Adopting biofuels on a large scale would be a disaster that might actually result in human-tragedy faster than an Earth-tragedy. Both Earth-firsters and People-firsters should make it clear that this is no long-term solution, only a delay tactic, one with it's own consequences. The thought of wasting the Earth's precious gift of food on private transportation for the wealthiest humans while others starve is repulsive. </p><p>
We must stress efficiency and public transportation over short-cut pseudo-solutions that only delay the changes that are needed to solve our problems.</p><p>
Face it folks, we must advocate for an end to private transportation, in our lifetimes- anything else only extends our consumerism and deepens the wound to the Earth.</p>
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				<p><strong>kill the car and save the planet</strong></p><p>Thanks, Karen, for clearly stating what should be obvious to anyone who values wilderness and also wants to feed all of humanity. Adopting biofuels on a large scale would be a disaster that might actually result in human-tragedy faster than an Earth-tragedy. Both Earth-firsters and People-firsters should make it clear that this is no long-term solution, only a delay tactic, one with it's own consequences. The thought of wasting the Earth's precious gift of food on private transportation for the wealthiest humans while others starve is repulsive. </p><p>
We must stress efficiency and public transportation over short-cut pseudo-solutions that only delay the changes that are needed to solve our problems.</p><p>
Face it folks, we must advocate for an end to private transportation, in our lifetimes- anything else only extends our consumerism and deepens the wound to the Earth.</p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by jdhlax</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 02 Mar 2006 17:55:12 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/13</guid>
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				<p><strong>Thanks Birdboy ...</strong></p><p>for saying this so I didn't have to, though I guess my previous posts make my position clear. &nbsp;We could start by removing private motor vehicles from urban areas, in which subways could be built so that people have no need for cars.</p>
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				<p><strong>Thanks Birdboy ...</strong></p><p>for saying this so I didn't have to, though I guess my previous posts make my position clear. &nbsp;We could start by removing private motor vehicles from urban areas, in which subways could be built so that people have no need for cars.</p>
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            <title>Comment #14 by howardgw</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 04 Mar 2006 08:32:28 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/14</guid>
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				<p><strong>corn ethanol</strong></p><p>The amount of land required to offset a significant amount of fossil fuel transportation uses is much in debate. Under current crop yields and conversion efficiency, corn yields about 358 gallons of ethanol per acre annually and switchgrass 165 gallons per acre. Replacement of current U.S. gasoline demand (139 billion gallons per year) by corn ethanol would require 407 million acres and replacement by switchgrass ethanol 840 million acres on an equal energy basis. These land requirements exceed the current total U.S. cropland, leaving no land for growing food. The Natural Resources Defense Council has proposed a program to reduce land requirements for switchgrass to replace not only current demand for gasoline, but that projected from current trends to be in demand by 2050 (289 billion gallons per year) to as little as 6 million acres. 66 percent of this gain is the result of conservation and 34 percent the result of technological improvements in crop yield and conversion processes and juggling existing cropland uses.<br>
The rush to biofuels has some major problems: Almost the entire focus of current considerations is on replacing present and future demand for fossil fuels with plant products. The highly concentrated energy contained in fossil fuels came from the same generic feedstock as we are presently proposing, yet it was distilled by millions of years of geologic processes. Today's biofuels do not have the benefit of those processes, so their energy yield is far below that of fossil fuels. <br>
To put the matter in perspective, worldwide primary power consumption is about 13 trillion watts (Tw) per year, with fossil fuels supplying 11 Tw of that power (85 percent). Replacing just the U.S. fossil energy consumption with bioenergy confronts a basic energy imbalance: each year the nation uses 85 percent more fossil fuel energy than the total energy amount stored annually in all U.S. plant biomass. Replacing current world fossil fuel demand with biomass would put more than 10 percent of the earth's land mass--nearly all agricultural land--into fuel rather than food crops. This means that the earth simply cannot grow enough biomass to supply energy at U.S. consumption levels.With world demand projected to require another 30 Tw by 2050, our choice becomes driving or eating, but not both. <br>
This focus on what goes into the tank also ignores the fact that the tank, and the vehicle carrying the tank, do not come out of thin air. Many of the components of vehicles come from mined products that are increasingly scarce, the recovery of which requires ever-increasing amounts of energy.<br>
</br></br></br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>corn ethanol</strong></p><p>The amount of land required to offset a significant amount of fossil fuel transportation uses is much in debate. Under current crop yields and conversion efficiency, corn yields about 358 gallons of ethanol per acre annually and switchgrass 165 gallons per acre. Replacement of current U.S. gasoline demand (139 billion gallons per year) by corn ethanol would require 407 million acres and replacement by switchgrass ethanol 840 million acres on an equal energy basis. These land requirements exceed the current total U.S. cropland, leaving no land for growing food. The Natural Resources Defense Council has proposed a program to reduce land requirements for switchgrass to replace not only current demand for gasoline, but that projected from current trends to be in demand by 2050 (289 billion gallons per year) to as little as 6 million acres. 66 percent of this gain is the result of conservation and 34 percent the result of technological improvements in crop yield and conversion processes and juggling existing cropland uses.<br>
The rush to biofuels has some major problems: Almost the entire focus of current considerations is on replacing present and future demand for fossil fuels with plant products. The highly concentrated energy contained in fossil fuels came from the same generic feedstock as we are presently proposing, yet it was distilled by millions of years of geologic processes. Today's biofuels do not have the benefit of those processes, so their energy yield is far below that of fossil fuels. <br>
To put the matter in perspective, worldwide primary power consumption is about 13 trillion watts (Tw) per year, with fossil fuels supplying 11 Tw of that power (85 percent). Replacing just the U.S. fossil energy consumption with bioenergy confronts a basic energy imbalance: each year the nation uses 85 percent more fossil fuel energy than the total energy amount stored annually in all U.S. plant biomass. Replacing current world fossil fuel demand with biomass would put more than 10 percent of the earth's land mass--nearly all agricultural land--into fuel rather than food crops. This means that the earth simply cannot grow enough biomass to supply energy at U.S. consumption levels.With world demand projected to require another 30 Tw by 2050, our choice becomes driving or eating, but not both. <br>
This focus on what goes into the tank also ignores the fact that the tank, and the vehicle carrying the tank, do not come out of thin air. Many of the components of vehicles come from mined products that are increasingly scarce, the recovery of which requires ever-increasing amounts of energy.<br>
</br></br></br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #15 by Karen Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 26 Mar 2006 01:46:06 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/15</guid>
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				<p><strong>The adoption of biofuels would be a disaster<p>&nbsp;The movement toward biofuels as an environmentally friendly alternative<br>
to fossil fuels is a greenscam with potentially disastrous consequences.<p>
The Bush brothers, a cabal of giant agro businesses, their paid<br>
consultants and political cronies are behind a series of initiatives that<br>
involve massive taxpayer funded subsidies to large environmentally<br>
destructive corporations. Sadly, they're aided by a number of well<br>
meaning but misguided groups and individuals.<p>
Biofuels derived from corn, palm, soybeans, and other crops are not only<br>
environmentally destructive, they can't be produced profitably without<br>
massive subsidies - subsidies that should be used for environmentally<br>
viable solutions such as conservation/efficiency initiatives and wind<br>
and solar energy.<p>
Biofuels are an economic, environmental and humanitarian disaster:<p>
* &nbsp;The production of biofuel from crops consumes more energy than it<br>
produces.<p>
* &nbsp;The production of biofuels from crops will lead to more air<br>
pollution, irreversible soil depletion, water depletion and pollution,<br>
erosion, forest destruction, higher use of fossil fuels, pesticides,<br>
fertilizers and harm to animals.<p>
* &nbsp;Crops to produce oils to meet the demand for biofuel are directly<br>
destroying tens of thousands of square miles of rain forest now.<p>
* &nbsp;Fertilizer for biofuel production will lead to a massive increase in<br>
phosphate strip mining, destroyed wetlands, poisoned water and disturbed<br>
river systems.<p>
* &nbsp;Conversion of U.S. farmland from food production to fuel crop<br>
production will lead to dependence on foreign nations for our food supply.<p>
The subsidies required to make biofuel production "viable" are more<br>
corporate welfare to the same giant agro companies damaging the<br>
environment now. They divert funds from real solutions such as<br>
conservation/efficiency initiatives, public transportation systems,<br>
increased use of solar and wind energy, and sustainable small scale food<br>
farming vs. massive monoculture fuel crop production.<p>
Government mandates of biofuels for transport will further hasten<br>
environmental destruction.<p>
We can't grow our way out of the impending energy crisis with more<br>
destructive practices that fuel more cars for more people to drive on<br>
more roads to more parking lots to buy more junk.<p>
The hard decisions can no longer be avoided. &nbsp;There must be a massive<br>
shift in our thinking, behavior and consumption.<p>
The biofuels scam must be stopped in its' tracks. If it proceeds, we'll<br>
plunge further into debt, destroy irreplaceable natural resources and<br>
send another portion of the biosphere up in smoke. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;<p>
If you'd like more information on biofuels, see the Energy Justice Network FACT SHEET<br>
&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html), Feeding Cars Not People<br>
&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/) and<br>
Worse Than Fossil Fuel (<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/ ) </a></br></a></br></a></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></br></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></br></p></br></p></p></br></br></br></br></p></br></br></br></br></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>The adoption of biofuels would be a disaster<p>&nbsp;The movement toward biofuels as an environmentally friendly alternative<br>
to fossil fuels is a greenscam with potentially disastrous consequences.<p>
The Bush brothers, a cabal of giant agro businesses, their paid<br>
consultants and political cronies are behind a series of initiatives that<br>
involve massive taxpayer funded subsidies to large environmentally<br>
destructive corporations. Sadly, they're aided by a number of well<br>
meaning but misguided groups and individuals.<p>
Biofuels derived from corn, palm, soybeans, and other crops are not only<br>
environmentally destructive, they can't be produced profitably without<br>
massive subsidies - subsidies that should be used for environmentally<br>
viable solutions such as conservation/efficiency initiatives and wind<br>
and solar energy.<p>
Biofuels are an economic, environmental and humanitarian disaster:<p>
* &nbsp;The production of biofuel from crops consumes more energy than it<br>
produces.<p>
* &nbsp;The production of biofuels from crops will lead to more air<br>
pollution, irreversible soil depletion, water depletion and pollution,<br>
erosion, forest destruction, higher use of fossil fuels, pesticides,<br>
fertilizers and harm to animals.<p>
* &nbsp;Crops to produce oils to meet the demand for biofuel are directly<br>
destroying tens of thousands of square miles of rain forest now.<p>
* &nbsp;Fertilizer for biofuel production will lead to a massive increase in<br>
phosphate strip mining, destroyed wetlands, poisoned water and disturbed<br>
river systems.<p>
* &nbsp;Conversion of U.S. farmland from food production to fuel crop<br>
production will lead to dependence on foreign nations for our food supply.<p>
The subsidies required to make biofuel production "viable" are more<br>
corporate welfare to the same giant agro companies damaging the<br>
environment now. They divert funds from real solutions such as<br>
conservation/efficiency initiatives, public transportation systems,<br>
increased use of solar and wind energy, and sustainable small scale food<br>
farming vs. massive monoculture fuel crop production.<p>
Government mandates of biofuels for transport will further hasten<br>
environmental destruction.<p>
We can't grow our way out of the impending energy crisis with more<br>
destructive practices that fuel more cars for more people to drive on<br>
more roads to more parking lots to buy more junk.<p>
The hard decisions can no longer be avoided. &nbsp;There must be a massive<br>
shift in our thinking, behavior and consumption.<p>
The biofuels scam must be stopped in its' tracks. If it proceeds, we'll<br>
plunge further into debt, destroy irreplaceable natural resources and<br>
send another portion of the biosphere up in smoke. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;<p>
If you'd like more information on biofuels, see the Energy Justice Network FACT SHEET<br>
&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net/ethanol/factsheet.html), Feeding Cars Not People<br>
&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/11/23/feeding-cars-not-people/) and<br>
Worse Than Fossil Fuel (<a href="http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/" rel="nofollow">http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/ ) </a></br></a></br></a></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></br></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></p></br></p></br></br></br></p></br></p></p></br></br></br></br></p></br></br></br></br></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #16 by atreyger</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 26 Mar 2006 05:57:49 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/16</guid>
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				<p><strong>Jeff and birdboy</strong></p><p>So how did you go about killing the car? Do you walk to the farmfields? How about the subway, what's powering that? And how do you go about heating your home?</p>
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				<p><strong>Jeff and birdboy</strong></p><p>So how did you go about killing the car? Do you walk to the farmfields? How about the subway, what's powering that? And how do you go about heating your home?</p>
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            <title>Comment #17 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 26 Mar 2006 18:28:17 -0800</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/17</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>How about this?<p><a href="http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog/_archives/2006/3/26/1841702.html" rel="nofollow">http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog/_archives/2006/3/26/1841702.html<p>
Maybe this will power electric cars and geothermal heat pumps. &nbsp;Only need to kill the internal combustion engine, not the car.</p></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>How about this?<p><a href="http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog/_archives/2006/3/26/1841702.html" rel="nofollow">http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog/_archives/2006/3/26/1841702.html<p>
Maybe this will power electric cars and geothermal heat pumps. &nbsp;Only need to kill the internal combustion engine, not the car.</p></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #18 by latenac</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 18 May 2006 06:05:33 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/griscom-little7/18</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>thank you</strong></p><p>It seems like now all I hear is ethanol this and ethanol that. It's going to be the saviour of everything. I keep thinking back to this episode of West Wing I saw where Toby talks about how it takes more fuel to make ethanol that it actually saves. It's sad that all of this hype is for naught but good to know I'm not crazy.</p>
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				<p><strong>thank you</strong></p><p>It seems like now all I hear is ethanol this and ethanol that. It's going to be the saviour of everything. I keep thinking back to this episode of West Wing I saw where Toby talks about how it takes more fuel to make ethanol that it actually saves. It's sad that all of this hype is for naught but good to know I'm not crazy.</p>
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