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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for All ten of &#8216;em]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 07:16:40 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Punt!<p>Even Gore must realize how weak his arguments have become if all he proposes is to get rid of light bulbs.<p>
I mean seriously, the jig is up.

<p>The Texeme Construct offers international text memetics construction and textcasting services.  <a href="http://www.you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.you-read-it-here-first.com</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Punt!<p>Even Gore must realize how weak his arguments have become if all he proposes is to get rid of light bulbs.<p>
I mean seriously, the jig is up.

<p>The Texeme Construct offers international text memetics construction and textcasting services.  <a href="http://www.you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.you-read-it-here-first.com</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Zarkov</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 07:19:49 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Blood on Your Hands</strong></p><p>Gore is really an idiot.</p><p>
Listen to the self proclaimed guru at your own risk</p><p>
Bah, your risk ????</p><p>
OUR risk</p><p>
This must-do list is ludicrous, short sighted and just plain childish. &nbsp;It will not change the progress of Global Climate Change even slightly.</p><p>
Y'all had better get out of your dream and into the real world.</p>
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				<p><strong>Blood on Your Hands</strong></p><p>Gore is really an idiot.</p><p>
Listen to the self proclaimed guru at your own risk</p><p>
Bah, your risk ????</p><p>
OUR risk</p><p>
This must-do list is ludicrous, short sighted and just plain childish. &nbsp;It will not change the progress of Global Climate Change even slightly.</p><p>
Y'all had better get out of your dream and into the real world.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by zacaroni</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 07:51:24 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>Grow up.</strong></p><p>Have either of you got any better suggestions? &nbsp;Zarkov refuses to point out better, less "childish" alternatives to Gore's recommendations, and instead resorts to ad-hominem attacks. &nbsp;And jabailo: what would you suggest? &nbsp;Did you foget to read the parts that were not about light bulbs? &nbsp;Give some stronger arguments - otherwise, I'll listen to Gore.</p>
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				<p><strong>Grow up.</strong></p><p>Have either of you got any better suggestions? &nbsp;Zarkov refuses to point out better, less "childish" alternatives to Gore's recommendations, and instead resorts to ad-hominem attacks. &nbsp;And jabailo: what would you suggest? &nbsp;Did you foget to read the parts that were not about light bulbs? &nbsp;Give some stronger arguments - otherwise, I'll listen to Gore.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by zacaroni</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 07:52:26 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Spelling</strong></p><p>"Forget." &nbsp;It's been a long day!</p>
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				<p><strong>Spelling</strong></p><p>"Forget." &nbsp;It's been a long day!</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by roundroom</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:22:54 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>indeed</strong></p><p>most of those are good suggestions<br>
but i would have to say it'll be tough to get other countries to sign treaties. Especially if there third world nations. </br></p>
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				<p><strong>indeed</strong></p><p>most of those are good suggestions<br>
but i would have to say it'll be tough to get other countries to sign treaties. Especially if there third world nations. </br></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Jason D Scorse</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 08:23:38 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>These are very serious proposals...<p>though I don't quite get the need to throw in the lightbulbs issue- kind of detracts from the whole thing- but impressive nonetheless. Very close to what the best and brightest economists have suggested on the policy side, although economists tend not to favor immediate moratoriums- but that's not a huge detail. I think David is right- how can you wage a presidential campaign on something this sensible? Never been done before to my knowledge.<p>
J.S.

<p>I teach environmental economics and blog at <a href="http://www.voicesofreason.info" rel="nofollow">http://www.voicesofreason.info. I am a proud liberal, who stands on the shoulders of giants.</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>These are very serious proposals...<p>though I don't quite get the need to throw in the lightbulbs issue- kind of detracts from the whole thing- but impressive nonetheless. Very close to what the best and brightest economists have suggested on the policy side, although economists tend not to favor immediate moratoriums- but that's not a huge detail. I think David is right- how can you wage a presidential campaign on something this sensible? Never been done before to my knowledge.<p>
J.S.

<p>I teach environmental economics and blog at <a href="http://www.voicesofreason.info" rel="nofollow">http://www.voicesofreason.info. I am a proud liberal, who stands on the shoulders of giants.</a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by ekillian</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:37:18 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>what don't people get about incandescent bulbs?<p>Everyone seems to be making fun of Gore's call for getting rid of incandescent lighting. Why? &nbsp;According to <a href="http://tinyurl.com/4wqka" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/4wqka one quarter of U.S. electricity use is for lighting. &nbsp;If all lighting were incandescent, and was replaced by fluorescent that is 4x the lumens/watt, then we would reduce our electric use by 18%. &nbsp;If that savings (366 TWh per year -- TWh = million megawatt hours) were selectively used to power down coal burning plants, the savings would be 0.363 gigatons of CO2 per year. &nbsp;That's a little bit of an overestimate, since some of our lighting is already fluorescent, but it gives you an idea of the magnitude of what is being talked about.<br>
</br></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>what don't people get about incandescent bulbs?<p>Everyone seems to be making fun of Gore's call for getting rid of incandescent lighting. Why? &nbsp;According to <a href="http://tinyurl.com/4wqka" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/4wqka one quarter of U.S. electricity use is for lighting. &nbsp;If all lighting were incandescent, and was replaced by fluorescent that is 4x the lumens/watt, then we would reduce our electric use by 18%. &nbsp;If that savings (366 TWh per year -- TWh = million megawatt hours) were selectively used to power down coal burning plants, the savings would be 0.363 gigatons of CO2 per year. &nbsp;That's a little bit of an overestimate, since some of our lighting is already fluorescent, but it gives you an idea of the magnitude of what is being talked about.<br>
</br></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Zarkov</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 11:16:39 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>LOL, can't you read</strong></p><p>&gt;&gt;&gt; Zarkov refuses to point out better, less "childish" alternatives...&gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
I have suggested many NEW technologies that do not leave a footprint. &nbsp;I am continuously ignored.</p><p>
Why because I am so far ahead of the established ideas, that you can't even see my dust.</p><p>
Read all posts made by Zarkov</p><p>
That will answer ALL your questions. </p><p>
&gt;&gt; ad-hominem remarks &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
never, I say it as it is.</p>
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				<p><strong>LOL, can't you read</strong></p><p>&gt;&gt;&gt; Zarkov refuses to point out better, less "childish" alternatives...&gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
I have suggested many NEW technologies that do not leave a footprint. &nbsp;I am continuously ignored.</p><p>
Why because I am so far ahead of the established ideas, that you can't even see my dust.</p><p>
Read all posts made by Zarkov</p><p>
That will answer ALL your questions. </p><p>
&gt;&gt; ad-hominem remarks &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
never, I say it as it is.</p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by Laurence Aurbach</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 11:27:08 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>lighting<p>Here's a more detailed source that says lighting uses 22% of US electricity:<p>
<a href="http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/info/documents/pdfs/lmc_vol1_final.pdf" rel="nofollow">National Lighting Inventory and Energy Consumption Estimate<p>
There's no question that it's significant. In terms of total US energy consumption (not just electricity), lighting uses about 8 percent of the total.</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>lighting<p>Here's a more detailed source that says lighting uses 22% of US electricity:<p>
<a href="http://www.eere.energy.gov/buildings/info/documents/pdfs/lmc_vol1_final.pdf" rel="nofollow">National Lighting Inventory and Energy Consumption Estimate<p>
There's no question that it's significant. In terms of total US energy consumption (not just electricity), lighting uses about 8 percent of the total.</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by Bart Anderson</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 Mar 2007 17:53:21 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>Rah, rah carbon tax<p>The key issue: Start a long-term tax shift to reduce payroll taxes and increase taxes on CO2 emissions.Good for Gore!

<p>Bart<br>
<a href="http://energybulletin.net" rel="nofollow">Energy Bulletin</a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Rah, rah carbon tax<p>The key issue: Start a long-term tax shift to reduce payroll taxes and increase taxes on CO2 emissions.Good for Gore!

<p>Bart<br>
<a href="http://energybulletin.net" rel="nofollow">Energy Bulletin</a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #11 by Sustainable Bend</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 22 Mar 2007 03:21:27 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/11</guid>
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				<p><strong>CAFE standards</strong></p><p>Our CAFE standards are lower than China's. &nbsp;Let's go folks, it's not that hard. &nbsp;Toyota has it figured out, why can't Detroit do it.</p>
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				<p><strong>CAFE standards</strong></p><p>Our CAFE standards are lower than China's. &nbsp;Let's go folks, it's not that hard. &nbsp;Toyota has it figured out, why can't Detroit do it.</p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by ekillian</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 22 Mar 2007 08:33:04 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/12</guid>
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				<p><strong>lighting<p>Thank you Laurence Aurbach for that reference.<p>
On another item, "Start a long-term tax shift to reduce payroll taxes and increase taxes on CO2 emissions": People might want to dig up an old monograph by Redefining Progress called "Tax Waste, Not Work".<p>
<a href="http://www.rprogress.org/newpubs/1997/twnw_execsum.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.rprogress.org/newpubs/1997/twnw_execsum.html<br>
</br></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>lighting<p>Thank you Laurence Aurbach for that reference.<p>
On another item, "Start a long-term tax shift to reduce payroll taxes and increase taxes on CO2 emissions": People might want to dig up an old monograph by Redefining Progress called "Tax Waste, Not Work".<p>
<a href="http://www.rprogress.org/newpubs/1997/twnw_execsum.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.rprogress.org/newpubs/1997/twnw_execsum.html<br>
</br></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by SunWave</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 27 Mar 2007 07:17:04 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/gores-legislative-recommendations-to-the-house/13</guid>
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				<p><strong>Lighting:  Efficiency, More Light, Less Energy?<p>What's not to like about efficient lighting?<p>
If our current stock of inefficient lighting represents 22% of all electrical energy consumed in the US, and if the adoption of more efficient technologies with a 2 year payback could cut that bill by 50%, then we could cut carbon emmissions by 11% in this sector in 2 years. &nbsp;The Energy Policy Act of 2005 incentives and many utilities are offering substantial rebates for investing in energy efficiency now. <p>
Often a simple "Change a Light Bulb" investment saving electricity now will yeild dividends for the next 5 to 10 years reducing CO2 in defacto excess of international standards. &nbsp;It puts a $50 dividend for every $5-10 investment back into the pockets of everyone that uses light bulbs or simulated daylight of any kind. &nbsp;Best of all we don't have to agree with anyone except ourselves in order to do it. &nbsp; <p>
It only takes 18 seconds to change a light bulb. &nbsp;See <a href="http://www.18seconds.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.18seconds.org to see how much money, energy and carbon are being saved in your area. &nbsp;<p>
See <a href="http://www.sunwavelighting" rel="nofollow">http://www.sunwavelighting. net for "Changing a Light Bulb and BCH (Boulder Community Hospital.) &nbsp;for a 2 minute look at lighting that is 50 to 75% more efficient on average than the lighting in the typical facility. &nbsp;<p>
See <a href="http://www.truths.treehugger.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.truths.treehugger.com for the Convenient Truths video contest finalists. &nbsp;Of particular interest are "Changing a Light Bulb", and "Chicken Enlightens, Human Learns, World Improves". &nbsp; If a hospital can do it and a chicken can teach a human how to do it, anyone can do it. <p>
Go right ahead, keep using inefficient lighting. &nbsp;The extra after-tax spendable money you willingly give to your energy supplier each month could have been yours. &nbsp;Instead, it goes up in smoke. &nbsp;<p>
Australia and others have announced a ban on incandescent light bulbs by the year 2009. &nbsp;Green on Ya, Mates. &nbsp; <p>
Steve Heising<br>
<a href="http://www.sunwavelighting.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.sunwavelighting.net

<p>Sunwave Spectrally Enhanced 25 Watt T8 Lamps 
1-866-4Sunwave
Most light - Least Energy - Win the energy reduction race and green up your bottom line.</p></a></br></p></p></p></a></p></a></p></a></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Lighting:  Efficiency, More Light, Less Energy?<p>What's not to like about efficient lighting?<p>
If our current stock of inefficient lighting represents 22% of all electrical energy consumed in the US, and if the adoption of more efficient technologies with a 2 year payback could cut that bill by 50%, then we could cut carbon emmissions by 11% in this sector in 2 years. &nbsp;The Energy Policy Act of 2005 incentives and many utilities are offering substantial rebates for investing in energy efficiency now. <p>
Often a simple "Change a Light Bulb" investment saving electricity now will yeild dividends for the next 5 to 10 years reducing CO2 in defacto excess of international standards. &nbsp;It puts a $50 dividend for every $5-10 investment back into the pockets of everyone that uses light bulbs or simulated daylight of any kind. &nbsp;Best of all we don't have to agree with anyone except ourselves in order to do it. &nbsp; <p>
It only takes 18 seconds to change a light bulb. &nbsp;See <a href="http://www.18seconds.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.18seconds.org to see how much money, energy and carbon are being saved in your area. &nbsp;<p>
See <a href="http://www.sunwavelighting" rel="nofollow">http://www.sunwavelighting. net for "Changing a Light Bulb and BCH (Boulder Community Hospital.) &nbsp;for a 2 minute look at lighting that is 50 to 75% more efficient on average than the lighting in the typical facility. &nbsp;<p>
See <a href="http://www.truths.treehugger.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.truths.treehugger.com for the Convenient Truths video contest finalists. &nbsp;Of particular interest are "Changing a Light Bulb", and "Chicken Enlightens, Human Learns, World Improves". &nbsp; If a hospital can do it and a chicken can teach a human how to do it, anyone can do it. <p>
Go right ahead, keep using inefficient lighting. &nbsp;The extra after-tax spendable money you willingly give to your energy supplier each month could have been yours. &nbsp;Instead, it goes up in smoke. &nbsp;<p>
Australia and others have announced a ban on incandescent light bulbs by the year 2009. &nbsp;Green on Ya, Mates. &nbsp; <p>
Steve Heising<br>
<a href="http://www.sunwavelighting.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.sunwavelighting.net

<p>Sunwave Spectrally Enhanced 25 Watt T8 Lamps 
1-866-4Sunwave
Most light - Least Energy - Win the energy reduction race and green up your bottom line.</p></a></br></p></p></p></a></p></a></p></a></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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