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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for How food processing got into the hands of a few giant companies]]></title>
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	<description>Grist Comment Feed</description>
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            <title>Comment #1 by raevynn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 04:01:24 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Better to just not<p>... support the dairy and meat industries. They are no longer concerned about healthy, clean products for people, all they care about is their bottom line.<p>
It takes 4200 gallons of water, PER DAY, to support a person consuming the Standard American Diet (SAD), from production, agricultural wastes, etc. It takes 300 gallons of water per day to support a Vegan. Source: <a href="http://www.veganpeace.com/veganism/environment.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.veganpeace.com/veganism/environment.htm<p>
I'm saving the environment. You can, too!</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Better to just not<p>... support the dairy and meat industries. They are no longer concerned about healthy, clean products for people, all they care about is their bottom line.<p>
It takes 4200 gallons of water, PER DAY, to support a person consuming the Standard American Diet (SAD), from production, agricultural wastes, etc. It takes 300 gallons of water per day to support a Vegan. Source: <a href="http://www.veganpeace.com/veganism/environment.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.veganpeace.com/veganism/environment.htm<p>
I'm saving the environment. You can, too!</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Swan400</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 08:42:36 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Industrial Workforce</strong></p><p>The consolidation of the food industry is a result of a cheap workforce, and thus cheap imports. Back when people got paid more for their labor, including the farmers, the food processing facilities were close to both the producers, and the markets. This was because the local farmer had enough income to stay in business, and not sell out their farm to have the land developed into McMansions, and endless Big Box strip malls. Thus there was a large enough local supply to keep a local food processor in business. Today it takes a corporate farm to produce food cheap, and they are often far from the local markets. &nbsp;The food instead is imported into the local from anywhere in the world. Remember that New Jersey was once the Garden State because of the food it grew, and sold to New York.</p>
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				<p><strong>Industrial Workforce</strong></p><p>The consolidation of the food industry is a result of a cheap workforce, and thus cheap imports. Back when people got paid more for their labor, including the farmers, the food processing facilities were close to both the producers, and the markets. This was because the local farmer had enough income to stay in business, and not sell out their farm to have the land developed into McMansions, and endless Big Box strip malls. Thus there was a large enough local supply to keep a local food processor in business. Today it takes a corporate farm to produce food cheap, and they are often far from the local markets. &nbsp;The food instead is imported into the local from anywhere in the world. Remember that New Jersey was once the Garden State because of the food it grew, and sold to New York.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by bralessliving</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 09:06:19 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>I was just talking about this</strong></p><p>I was just discussing this on my blog. How local farming if it gets popular will simply get gobbled up by the big guns...</p><p>
Thanks so much for giving me info so that I can continue to be right. That's like my favorite hobby.</p>
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				<p><strong>I was just talking about this</strong></p><p>I was just discussing this on my blog. How local farming if it gets popular will simply get gobbled up by the big guns...</p><p>
Thanks so much for giving me info so that I can continue to be right. That's like my favorite hobby.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by ronwagn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:27:40 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Small farms</strong></p><p>What ever happened to entrepreneurs in agriculture. Why can't these dairymen, farmers, and hog raisers sell a finished product? We need real farmers markets.</p><p>
I heard about Chino California dairymen closing up because they didn't want to clean up their dung. They could have easily built a methane digester, and produced their own electricity.</p><p>
When I was in California recently, I bought fresh produce from a local stand, including flowers. I also visited an ostrich farm. They charged admission, sold us the food to feed their ostriches, sold ostrich meat, empty eggshells, and even charged a quarter for a chip of a broken egg! As we were leaving, I commented that they didn't charge for parking, yet.</p><p>
Farmers here in Illinois don't bother with anything except corn and soybeans. Maybe a few hogs or cattle. Nobody bothers to sell pork or beef direct. </p><p>
Ron Wagner </p>
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				<p><strong>Small farms</strong></p><p>What ever happened to entrepreneurs in agriculture. Why can't these dairymen, farmers, and hog raisers sell a finished product? We need real farmers markets.</p><p>
I heard about Chino California dairymen closing up because they didn't want to clean up their dung. They could have easily built a methane digester, and produced their own electricity.</p><p>
When I was in California recently, I bought fresh produce from a local stand, including flowers. I also visited an ostrich farm. They charged admission, sold us the food to feed their ostriches, sold ostrich meat, empty eggshells, and even charged a quarter for a chip of a broken egg! As we were leaving, I commented that they didn't charge for parking, yet.</p><p>
Farmers here in Illinois don't bother with anything except corn and soybeans. Maybe a few hogs or cattle. Nobody bothers to sell pork or beef direct. </p><p>
Ron Wagner </p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by meander</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 15:41:20 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Changing attitudes in Iowa<p>The concentration of the animal raising industry is also having negative impacts on attitudes towards agriculture in general. &nbsp;The Dept. of Economics page at Iowa State has a report called <a href="http://www.econ.iastate.edu/research/publications/viewabstract.asp?pid=12581" rel="nofollow">Iowa's Changing Swine Industry which says this about Iowans' changing attitudes about hog raising:<br>
Pigs once viewed positively across Iowa may now be viewed negatively. Pigs in rural Iowa were once called 'mortgage lifters' and pig manure odor was the 'smell of money.' But in 2004, the ISU Rural Life Poll found that when rural Iowa residents were asked their preferences about rural development activity, hog confinements ranked below prisons, solid waste landfills, slaughter plants, and sewage treatment plants as desirable rural development.<br>
</br></br></a></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Changing attitudes in Iowa<p>The concentration of the animal raising industry is also having negative impacts on attitudes towards agriculture in general. &nbsp;The Dept. of Economics page at Iowa State has a report called <a href="http://www.econ.iastate.edu/research/publications/viewabstract.asp?pid=12581" rel="nofollow">Iowa's Changing Swine Industry which says this about Iowans' changing attitudes about hog raising:<br>
Pigs once viewed positively across Iowa may now be viewed negatively. Pigs in rural Iowa were once called 'mortgage lifters' and pig manure odor was the 'smell of money.' But in 2004, the ISU Rural Life Poll found that when rural Iowa residents were asked their preferences about rural development activity, hog confinements ranked below prisons, solid waste landfills, slaughter plants, and sewage treatment plants as desirable rural development.<br>
</br></br></a></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 01:43:23 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>People -- PeeeeoooPle</strong></p><p><br>
I'm always chagrined when people talk about the "large corporations" owning things.</p><p>
But, most corporations have a few people who tightly hold big portions of those assets -- the Top 3% who own 84% of everything.</p><p>
So, for a story like this, it's not about Wal*mart or conglomerates. &nbsp; </p><p>
You have to ask the question why people have to work their whole life to buy a $400,000 house on a plot of land that couldn't grow enough food for a ocelot.<br>
</br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>People -- PeeeeoooPle</strong></p><p><br>
I'm always chagrined when people talk about the "large corporations" owning things.</p><p>
But, most corporations have a few people who tightly hold big portions of those assets -- the Top 3% who own 84% of everything.</p><p>
So, for a story like this, it's not about Wal*mart or conglomerates. &nbsp; </p><p>
You have to ask the question why people have to work their whole life to buy a $400,000 house on a plot of land that couldn't grow enough food for a ocelot.<br>
</br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by sasquatch</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 03:35:56 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>its not just evil corporations...</strong></p><p>.... its also the willful ignorance of the consumer. &nbsp; &nbsp;these mega-corporations are able to gobble up market share and take out better, smaller and more natural farms by providing what the consumer will buy.</p><p>
There is ample information available (at least in the US) regarding the policies and internal processes of companies like Tyson, etc. and if people bothered to look, they would most likely make different choices.</p><p>
But the truth is unpleasant, and causes one to feel bad for the animals and bad for themselves. &nbsp;So instead of adjusting behavior they look away and turn up the ipod. This is not just a corporation problem - its a society-wide issue where consumers do not have to bear the full consequences of their actions (whether its CO2, water use, etc.)</p><p>
Imagine if we paid the full price of food, water, electricity or transportation, when all of the ecological services were incorporated into the costs of these items. &nbsp;</p><p>
any ideas on how to do that?</p>
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				<p><strong>its not just evil corporations...</strong></p><p>.... its also the willful ignorance of the consumer. &nbsp; &nbsp;these mega-corporations are able to gobble up market share and take out better, smaller and more natural farms by providing what the consumer will buy.</p><p>
There is ample information available (at least in the US) regarding the policies and internal processes of companies like Tyson, etc. and if people bothered to look, they would most likely make different choices.</p><p>
But the truth is unpleasant, and causes one to feel bad for the animals and bad for themselves. &nbsp;So instead of adjusting behavior they look away and turn up the ipod. This is not just a corporation problem - its a society-wide issue where consumers do not have to bear the full consequences of their actions (whether its CO2, water use, etc.)</p><p>
Imagine if we paid the full price of food, water, electricity or transportation, when all of the ecological services were incorporated into the costs of these items. &nbsp;</p><p>
any ideas on how to do that?</p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by blueberrysushi</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 04:15:25 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>Ginger</strong></p><p>I just slaughtered a chicken (Ginger) the other day. It was my first. I got 6 chickens a couple of months ago, and they've been providing me with eggs; one of them got her leg grabbed by a raccoon, resulting in a compound fracture. So I invited my buddy over and we killed her and then plucked her and made her into soup.</p><p>
Ginger was a breathing thing, and she used to let me hold her, and when she got hurt, she stopped running around and clawing at the ground and so it was her time.</p><p>
Just a story. &nbsp;</p><p>
When consolidation is discussed, it is such a large and intangible problem. Many people seem to discuss it as a given, a fact of the market. But in little ways, as we all know, we can separate ourselves from that market and stop being zombies. We can decide to value things that drive economists mad: the intangibles, the externalities. That is when local markets will work, when the market is no longer an excuse, but an efficient vehicle that actually provides the goods that allow us real options. Unfortunately, that means that some distortions (subsidies for grain and oil) may have to be replaced with other distortions (environmental regulations, land use laws). </p><p>
Ramble ramble.</p>
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				<p><strong>Ginger</strong></p><p>I just slaughtered a chicken (Ginger) the other day. It was my first. I got 6 chickens a couple of months ago, and they've been providing me with eggs; one of them got her leg grabbed by a raccoon, resulting in a compound fracture. So I invited my buddy over and we killed her and then plucked her and made her into soup.</p><p>
Ginger was a breathing thing, and she used to let me hold her, and when she got hurt, she stopped running around and clawing at the ground and so it was her time.</p><p>
Just a story. &nbsp;</p><p>
When consolidation is discussed, it is such a large and intangible problem. Many people seem to discuss it as a given, a fact of the market. But in little ways, as we all know, we can separate ourselves from that market and stop being zombies. We can decide to value things that drive economists mad: the intangibles, the externalities. That is when local markets will work, when the market is no longer an excuse, but an efficient vehicle that actually provides the goods that allow us real options. Unfortunately, that means that some distortions (subsidies for grain and oil) may have to be replaced with other distortions (environmental regulations, land use laws). </p><p>
Ramble ramble.</p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by Ron Steenblik</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 15:54:06 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>What about ethanol and CAFOs?</strong></p><p>Tom, I'd be curious to know whether you think that the drive for combining CAFOs with corn-ethanol plants -- both because of the availability of a co-product, dried distillers' grains and solubles (DDGS), and because the manure can be digested to produce process gas -- is contributing to the trend towards greater concentration in (at least the cattle segment of) the livestock industry?</p>
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				<p><strong>What about ethanol and CAFOs?</strong></p><p>Tom, I'd be curious to know whether you think that the drive for combining CAFOs with corn-ethanol plants -- both because of the availability of a co-product, dried distillers' grains and solubles (DDGS), and because the manure can be digested to produce process gas -- is contributing to the trend towards greater concentration in (at least the cattle segment of) the livestock industry?</p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by Karen Lee Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 00:41:35 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>Ethanol Biorefineries - Magnets for CAFOs<p>Hello Ron, Tom and all,<p>
In the November 2006 Muskegon Chronicle article "New ethanol plants spark concerns of factory farms," Michigan Sierra Club legislative director Gayle Miller states that building corn-based ethanol plants in Michigan could trigger a boom in CAFOs and increase water pollution.<p>
Ethanol plants attract dairy CAFOs because a byproduct of distilling corn can be used as a feed supplement for cattle.<p>
Michigan already has about 200 dairy, pig and poultry CAFOs that collectively generate more than 4 billion pounds of liquid manure annually, nearly all of which is spread untreated on farm fields, according to government data.<p>
Four ethanol plants have broken ground in Michigan since 2003, quadrupling the state's production of corn-based fuel, according to state officials. The state also has joined with General Motors, Meijer, and CleanFUEL USA to make ethanol available at more gas stations.<p>
In a July press release, Gov. Jennifer Granholm called the construction of more ethanol refineries and availability of the alternative fuel at more gas stations "important steps to fulfilling Michigan's next great destiny -- making our state and our nation independent of foreign oil."<p>
Gayle Miller said the number of dairy CAFOs increased in Iowa after corn-based ethanol plants sprouted there.<p>
Michigan's largest farm group, the Michigan Farm Bureau, actively promotes CAFOs. Farm Bureau officials claim CAFOs help farmers remain profitable by producing more food products at lower cost; the group also claims CAFOs cause less harm to the environment than smaller farms, according to the article.<p>
All Michigan farms are exempt from the state's air pollution control law, even though huge manure storage lagoons at CAFOs emit ammonia, methane and potentially deadly hydrogen sulfide gas.<p>
The Muskegon Chronicle article is no longer online but these issues are also raised by K. Myers of Wheatfield, Indiana. &nbsp;<p>
Shortly after the Myers family moved next to a wildlife reserve the picture changed with the discovery that a large hog CAFO &nbsp;was moving adjacent to the reserve and less than 2500 feet from their home.<p>
Myers writes about this in her blog post "The Ethanol CAFO Connection:"<br>
<a href="http://wahmdiary.blogspot.com/2006/11/ethanol-cafo-connection.html" rel="nofollow">http://wahmdiary.blogspot.com/2006/11/ethanol-cafo-connec ...<p>
I stumbled upon that article on the excellent Energy Justice Network website: &nbsp;<a href="http://www.energyjustice.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net<p>
Y'all might have read the AP report on Tyson, ConocoPhillips teaming up on diesel fuel made from animal fat<p>
The Tyson-Conoco CAFOdiesel project will produce "the next generation of renewable diesel fuel."<p>
"A new biofuel project will mean what's for dinner may also be what goes in the fuel tank with ConocoPhillips and Tyson Foods joining forces to make diesel fuel from animal byproducts<p>
The alliance plans to use beef, pork and poultry by-product fat to create a transportation fuel.<p>
"This fuel will contribute to America's energy security and help to address climate change concerns," the Tyson-Conoco statement said.<br>
<a href="http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/articles/0417biz-conoco0417.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/article ...<p>
Karen Orr<br>
Gainesville, Florida<br>
</br></br></p></a></br></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Ethanol Biorefineries - Magnets for CAFOs<p>Hello Ron, Tom and all,<p>
In the November 2006 Muskegon Chronicle article "New ethanol plants spark concerns of factory farms," Michigan Sierra Club legislative director Gayle Miller states that building corn-based ethanol plants in Michigan could trigger a boom in CAFOs and increase water pollution.<p>
Ethanol plants attract dairy CAFOs because a byproduct of distilling corn can be used as a feed supplement for cattle.<p>
Michigan already has about 200 dairy, pig and poultry CAFOs that collectively generate more than 4 billion pounds of liquid manure annually, nearly all of which is spread untreated on farm fields, according to government data.<p>
Four ethanol plants have broken ground in Michigan since 2003, quadrupling the state's production of corn-based fuel, according to state officials. The state also has joined with General Motors, Meijer, and CleanFUEL USA to make ethanol available at more gas stations.<p>
In a July press release, Gov. Jennifer Granholm called the construction of more ethanol refineries and availability of the alternative fuel at more gas stations "important steps to fulfilling Michigan's next great destiny -- making our state and our nation independent of foreign oil."<p>
Gayle Miller said the number of dairy CAFOs increased in Iowa after corn-based ethanol plants sprouted there.<p>
Michigan's largest farm group, the Michigan Farm Bureau, actively promotes CAFOs. Farm Bureau officials claim CAFOs help farmers remain profitable by producing more food products at lower cost; the group also claims CAFOs cause less harm to the environment than smaller farms, according to the article.<p>
All Michigan farms are exempt from the state's air pollution control law, even though huge manure storage lagoons at CAFOs emit ammonia, methane and potentially deadly hydrogen sulfide gas.<p>
The Muskegon Chronicle article is no longer online but these issues are also raised by K. Myers of Wheatfield, Indiana. &nbsp;<p>
Shortly after the Myers family moved next to a wildlife reserve the picture changed with the discovery that a large hog CAFO &nbsp;was moving adjacent to the reserve and less than 2500 feet from their home.<p>
Myers writes about this in her blog post "The Ethanol CAFO Connection:"<br>
<a href="http://wahmdiary.blogspot.com/2006/11/ethanol-cafo-connection.html" rel="nofollow">http://wahmdiary.blogspot.com/2006/11/ethanol-cafo-connec ...<p>
I stumbled upon that article on the excellent Energy Justice Network website: &nbsp;<a href="http://www.energyjustice.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyjustice.net<p>
Y'all might have read the AP report on Tyson, ConocoPhillips teaming up on diesel fuel made from animal fat<p>
The Tyson-Conoco CAFOdiesel project will produce "the next generation of renewable diesel fuel."<p>
"A new biofuel project will mean what's for dinner may also be what goes in the fuel tank with ConocoPhillips and Tyson Foods joining forces to make diesel fuel from animal byproducts<p>
The alliance plans to use beef, pork and poultry by-product fat to create a transportation fuel.<p>
"This fuel will contribute to America's energy security and help to address climate change concerns," the Tyson-Conoco statement said.<br>
<a href="http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/articles/0417biz-conoco0417.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/article ...<p>
Karen Orr<br>
Gainesville, Florida<br>
</br></br></p></a></br></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #11 by margarita</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 00:43:09 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/11</guid>
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				<p><strong>Education</strong></p><p>Like with all else, the public needs to be educated on these matters. &nbsp;Most people don't know (or care to know) where their food comes from or its cost--to the environment, to poorer people in other countries, sometimes, who produce it at the expense of their their own well-being. &nbsp;<br>
Funny that kids aren't taught about agriculture in school--aside from those kids in more rural areas. &nbsp;Divorced as our culture is from the land, perhaps putting these ideas back into the curricula would go a long way towards ensuring that future populations don't make the same mistakes.</br></p>
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				<p><strong>Education</strong></p><p>Like with all else, the public needs to be educated on these matters. &nbsp;Most people don't know (or care to know) where their food comes from or its cost--to the environment, to poorer people in other countries, sometimes, who produce it at the expense of their their own well-being. &nbsp;<br>
Funny that kids aren't taught about agriculture in school--aside from those kids in more rural areas. &nbsp;Divorced as our culture is from the land, perhaps putting these ideas back into the curricula would go a long way towards ensuring that future populations don't make the same mistakes.</br></p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by pat pbg fl</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 09:30:45 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/12</guid>
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				<p><strong>Agribusiness</strong></p><p>Some 40+ years ago my father warned his four kids that huge companies were buying up small farms and that one day, since we all have to buy food to eat, they were really going to come down on us. &nbsp;And he didn't mean price-wise. &nbsp;</p><p>
His prediction seems to have borne fruit (pun) and had some meat to it (pun). &nbsp;Can't think of how to pun a veggie. &nbsp;Being 74 now, I don't worry about it too much. &nbsp;And, it would appear that there's not a whole lot of people that do, so far (present company excluded). </p>
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				<p><strong>Agribusiness</strong></p><p>Some 40+ years ago my father warned his four kids that huge companies were buying up small farms and that one day, since we all have to buy food to eat, they were really going to come down on us. &nbsp;And he didn't mean price-wise. &nbsp;</p><p>
His prediction seems to have borne fruit (pun) and had some meat to it (pun). &nbsp;Can't think of how to pun a veggie. &nbsp;Being 74 now, I don't worry about it too much. &nbsp;And, it would appear that there's not a whole lot of people that do, so far (present company excluded). </p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by blubird</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 06:30:45 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>say it right</strong></p><p>I would like to share three quotes that sum up what I believe about the general public and America's industrial-food culture (sorry if they seem out of context):</p><p>
"Eating puts us in touch with all that we share with other animals [and plants], and all that sets us apart. It's what defines us."</p><p>
"To eat with a fuller consciousness of all that is at stake might sound like a burden, but in practice few things in life can afford quite as much satisfaction."</p><p>
and finally,</p><p>
"Eating industrial meat [and other industrial produce/products] takes an almost heroic act of not knowing, or, [eventually] forgetting."</p><p>
- Quotes taken from Michael Pollan in his book, <strong>The Omnivore's Dilema, A Natural History of Four Meal</strong> &nbsp;(2006)</p>
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				<p><strong>say it right</strong></p><p>I would like to share three quotes that sum up what I believe about the general public and America's industrial-food culture (sorry if they seem out of context):</p><p>
"Eating puts us in touch with all that we share with other animals [and plants], and all that sets us apart. It's what defines us."</p><p>
"To eat with a fuller consciousness of all that is at stake might sound like a burden, but in practice few things in life can afford quite as much satisfaction."</p><p>
and finally,</p><p>
"Eating industrial meat [and other industrial produce/products] takes an almost heroic act of not knowing, or, [eventually] forgetting."</p><p>
- Quotes taken from Michael Pollan in his book, <strong>The Omnivore's Dilema, A Natural History of Four Meal</strong> &nbsp;(2006)</p>
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            <title>Comment #14 by amie022</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 04 May 2007 05:31:36 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/14</guid>
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				<p><strong>No doubt</strong></p><p>I have no statistics for you, but I can attest that it is the big hog producers here in Iowa that people are worried about. When I visit my uncle's farm, you can't smell the hogs (few in number) until you get to within about 50 yards from the barn. But he's (according to the article) in the minority -- it's not HIS farm people don't want nearby -- it's the major producers. Because that will smell like hog ackey for miles away.</p>
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				<p><strong>No doubt</strong></p><p>I have no statistics for you, but I can attest that it is the big hog producers here in Iowa that people are worried about. When I visit my uncle's farm, you can't smell the hogs (few in number) until you get to within about 50 yards from the barn. But he's (according to the article) in the minority -- it's not HIS farm people don't want nearby -- it's the major producers. Because that will smell like hog ackey for miles away.</p>
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            <title>Comment #15 by Karen Lee Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 06 May 2007 21:54:59 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/15</guid>
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				<p><strong>Hog Hell<p>The following is excerpted from the Treehugger review of Jeff Tietz's excellent Rolling Stone article,"Boss Hog: Welcome to the Dark Side of the Other White Meat."<p>
The Treehugger link will take you to the Jeff Tietz article:<br>
<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1.php" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1 ...<p>
&nbsp;"America's top pork producer churns out a sea of waste that has destroyed rivers, killed millions of fish and generated one of the largest fines in EPA history" It is a dire and frightening tale. The first paragraph has perhaps the year's longest run-on sentence, designed to convey the scale of the industry and the analogy to human beings is stunningly effective.<p>
"Smithfield Foods, the largest and most profitable pork processor in the world, killed 27 million hogs last year. That's a number worth considering. A slaughter-weight hog is fifty percent heavier than a person. The logistical challenge of processing that many pigs each year is roughly equivalent to butchering and boxing the entire human populations of New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston, Philadelphia, Phoenix, San Antonio, San Diego, Dallas, San Jose, Detroit, Indianapolis, Jacksonville, San Francisco, Columbus, Austin, Memphis, Baltimore, Fort Worth, Charlotte, El Paso, Milwaukee, Seattle, Boston, Denver, Louisville, Washington, D.C., Nashville, Las Vegas, Portland, Oklahoma City and Tucson."<p>
The article continues in that style, hitting you with statistics and similes. "A lot of pig shit is one thing; a lot of highly toxic pig shit is another. The excrement of Smithfield hogs is hardly even pig shit: On a continuum of pollutants, it is probably closer to radioactive waste than to organic manure. " and 26 million tons of it are discharged each year. Into holding ponds, sprayed on fields, leaking into rivers.<p>
The article is primarily about shit. It briefly touches on animal welfare- "Smithfield's pigs live by the hundreds or thousands in warehouse-like barns, in rows of wall-to-wall pens. Sows are artificially inseminated and fed and delivered of their piglets in cages so small they cannot turn around. Forty fully grown 250-pound male hogs often occupy a pen the size of a tiny apartment. They trample each other to death. There is no sunlight, straw, fresh air or earth." Which doesn't get much of a response from Smithfield Chairman Joseph Luter : "The animal-rights people," he once said, "want to impose a vegetarian's society on the U.S. Most vegetarians I know are neurotic."<p>
It then goes back to looking at what is in pigshit, how it is dealt with, where it goes and how it gets into the environment.<p>
People become vegetarians for various reasons; personal health and concern for animal welfare are big ones. It is likely that environmental concerns are becoming a major cause. &nbsp;The carbon footprint of a hamburger and the water footprint of a pound of meat. Learning about the shit footprint of a pound of pork has put me over the edge. I know what my New Year's resolution is: no more factory farmed meat. <p>
Full Treehugger review and link to "Boss Hog:"<br>
<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1.php" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1 ...</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Hog Hell<p>The following is excerpted from the Treehugger review of Jeff Tietz's excellent Rolling Stone article,"Boss Hog: Welcome to the Dark Side of the Other White Meat."<p>
The Treehugger link will take you to the Jeff Tietz article:<br>
<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1.php" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1 ...<p>
&nbsp;"America's top pork producer churns out a sea of waste that has destroyed rivers, killed millions of fish and generated one of the largest fines in EPA history" It is a dire and frightening tale. The first paragraph has perhaps the year's longest run-on sentence, designed to convey the scale of the industry and the analogy to human beings is stunningly effective.<p>
"Smithfield Foods, the largest and most profitable pork processor in the world, killed 27 million hogs last year. That's a number worth considering. A slaughter-weight hog is fifty percent heavier than a person. The logistical challenge of processing that many pigs each year is roughly equivalent to butchering and boxing the entire human populations of New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston, Philadelphia, Phoenix, San Antonio, San Diego, Dallas, San Jose, Detroit, Indianapolis, Jacksonville, San Francisco, Columbus, Austin, Memphis, Baltimore, Fort Worth, Charlotte, El Paso, Milwaukee, Seattle, Boston, Denver, Louisville, Washington, D.C., Nashville, Las Vegas, Portland, Oklahoma City and Tucson."<p>
The article continues in that style, hitting you with statistics and similes. "A lot of pig shit is one thing; a lot of highly toxic pig shit is another. The excrement of Smithfield hogs is hardly even pig shit: On a continuum of pollutants, it is probably closer to radioactive waste than to organic manure. " and 26 million tons of it are discharged each year. Into holding ponds, sprayed on fields, leaking into rivers.<p>
The article is primarily about shit. It briefly touches on animal welfare- "Smithfield's pigs live by the hundreds or thousands in warehouse-like barns, in rows of wall-to-wall pens. Sows are artificially inseminated and fed and delivered of their piglets in cages so small they cannot turn around. Forty fully grown 250-pound male hogs often occupy a pen the size of a tiny apartment. They trample each other to death. There is no sunlight, straw, fresh air or earth." Which doesn't get much of a response from Smithfield Chairman Joseph Luter : "The animal-rights people," he once said, "want to impose a vegetarian's society on the U.S. Most vegetarians I know are neurotic."<p>
It then goes back to looking at what is in pigshit, how it is dealt with, where it goes and how it gets into the environment.<p>
People become vegetarians for various reasons; personal health and concern for animal welfare are big ones. It is likely that environmental concerns are becoming a major cause. &nbsp;The carbon footprint of a hamburger and the water footprint of a pound of meat. Learning about the shit footprint of a pound of pork has put me over the edge. I know what my New Year's resolution is: no more factory farmed meat. <p>
Full Treehugger review and link to "Boss Hog:"<br>
<a href="http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1.php" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/12/boss_hog_rollin_1 ...</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></a></br></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #16 by Karen Lee Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/giants/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 07 May 2007 03:10:54 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/giants/16</guid>
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				<p><strong>Beyond Beef<p>Beef consumption plays a major role in the development of heart disease, strokes, and cancer. The over-consumption of beef is also a major cause of human hunger and poverty, deforestation, spreading deserts, water pollution, water scarcity, global warming, species extinction, and animal suffering.<p>
We in the United States are a big part or the problem. Americans consume almost a quarter of all the beef produced in the world. <p>
A growing awareness of the hidden environmental and health costs of beef consumption is leading more Americans adopt a plant based diet.<p>
Beyond Beef prepared a briefing kit about rainforest destruction, resource depletion, global warming, world hunger, human disease, animal suffering and other compelling reasons why more Americans are eating less beef.<p>
Here's the Beyond Beef report:<br>
<a href="http://www.mcspotlight.org/media/reports/beyond.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.mcspotlight.org/media/reports/beyond.html</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Beyond Beef<p>Beef consumption plays a major role in the development of heart disease, strokes, and cancer. The over-consumption of beef is also a major cause of human hunger and poverty, deforestation, spreading deserts, water pollution, water scarcity, global warming, species extinction, and animal suffering.<p>
We in the United States are a big part or the problem. Americans consume almost a quarter of all the beef produced in the world. <p>
A growing awareness of the hidden environmental and health costs of beef consumption is leading more Americans adopt a plant based diet.<p>
Beyond Beef prepared a briefing kit about rainforest destruction, resource depletion, global warming, world hunger, human disease, animal suffering and other compelling reasons why more Americans are eating less beef.<p>
Here's the Beyond Beef report:<br>
<a href="http://www.mcspotlight.org/media/reports/beyond.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.mcspotlight.org/media/reports/beyond.html</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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