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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Why we may one day bitterly regret GM crops]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by JMG</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jul 2007 08:19:40 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/1</guid>
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				<p><strong>Long term thinking required?</strong></p><p>You mean we're supposed to think about next quarter's returns too?

<p>Save the world:  Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Long term thinking required?</strong></p><p>You mean we're supposed to think about next quarter's returns too?

<p>Save the world:  Reduce greenhouse gas emissions 5% annually.</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Jon Rynn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jul 2007 12:28:32 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>So?...</strong></p><p>...what about the Social Forum? &nbsp;Can you tell us about it? &nbsp;Was environmentalism on anybody's agenda? &nbsp;Was anyone trying to link environmental concerns with other social problems? &nbsp;Link global warming to the economy, as in reconstructing the economy would be good for jobs? &nbsp;Social justice issues, anything about Hawken's Blessed Unrest movements? &nbsp;Maybe when your sore throat is better.</p>
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				<p><strong>So?...</strong></p><p>...what about the Social Forum? &nbsp;Can you tell us about it? &nbsp;Was environmentalism on anybody's agenda? &nbsp;Was anyone trying to link environmental concerns with other social problems? &nbsp;Link global warming to the economy, as in reconstructing the economy would be good for jobs? &nbsp;Social justice issues, anything about Hawken's Blessed Unrest movements? &nbsp;Maybe when your sore throat is better.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by Karen Lee Orr</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jul 2007 12:41:26 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/3</guid>
			<description><![CDATA[
				<p><strong>GMOs: They're What's for Dinner<p><br>
Andrew Kimbrell, founder and executive director of the Washington D.C.-based Center for Food Safety and the International Center for Technology Assessment, is interviewed on Alternet.<p>
Nearly three quarters of all processed foods contain genetically engineered ingredients, but you'd never know it by reading package labels. Andrew Kimbrell discusses the risks of genetic engineering and how to avoid it.<p>
Click below for "There's a Lot You Don't Know About What's in Your Food:"<br>
<a href="http://www.alternet.org/story/55847/" rel="nofollow">http://www.alternet.org/story/55847/<br>
</br></a></br></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>GMOs: They're What's for Dinner<p><br>
Andrew Kimbrell, founder and executive director of the Washington D.C.-based Center for Food Safety and the International Center for Technology Assessment, is interviewed on Alternet.<p>
Nearly three quarters of all processed foods contain genetically engineered ingredients, but you'd never know it by reading package labels. Andrew Kimbrell discusses the risks of genetic engineering and how to avoid it.<p>
Click below for "There's a Lot You Don't Know About What's in Your Food:"<br>
<a href="http://www.alternet.org/story/55847/" rel="nofollow">http://www.alternet.org/story/55847/<br>
</br></a></br></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by ChristianHGross</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jul 2007 17:35:44 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Really? No S*** Einstein...</strong></p><p>When I read this article and the item regarding Gene's I could not help, but think those exact words.</p><p>
Let me give you why I have been thinking this all along. I have lived in many many countries and the latest being Switzerland. Swiss are among those that live the longest. Every now and then I glance in the obituary and when I see people who died at 70 they usually add, "but he died way too early." Having people die at 80 to 95 is not rare in the obituary.</p><p>
So how is that Swiss live so long? They climb mountains, no kidding here. It is not rare to see a 65 year old mountain biking up a 3000 ft mountain. And they eat very healthy and natural. The Swiss care about their food and for the most part any food produced in Switzerland is organic by default. Combine the two and you get long life.</p><p>
But what made me really skeptical about the diet is something that happened in my family. My father got brain cancer and died at 56, and my mother got breast cancer. Both of my parents were German immigrants and cancer was essentially non-existent in either family tree. About 85% died of a heart attack or old age. I cannot remember any family member who died of cancer.</p><p>
This made me wonder. Why would a family that never had cancer get whacked twice? Maybe it is a statistical outlier. Or maybe there is a problem in the North American diet? My mom when she got breast cancer completely changed her diet and it appears five years and then some later all is ok even though she is living in North America.</p><p>
Makes you think, and it made me change my diet pronto...</p><p>
What is the diet of the Swiss, my mother and I? Easy NO, and I mean NO processed food. Cook from scratch, fresh vegetables, pumper-nickel type bread, reasonable amounts meat, plenty of natural cheese, etc.</p>
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				<p><strong>Really? No S*** Einstein...</strong></p><p>When I read this article and the item regarding Gene's I could not help, but think those exact words.</p><p>
Let me give you why I have been thinking this all along. I have lived in many many countries and the latest being Switzerland. Swiss are among those that live the longest. Every now and then I glance in the obituary and when I see people who died at 70 they usually add, "but he died way too early." Having people die at 80 to 95 is not rare in the obituary.</p><p>
So how is that Swiss live so long? They climb mountains, no kidding here. It is not rare to see a 65 year old mountain biking up a 3000 ft mountain. And they eat very healthy and natural. The Swiss care about their food and for the most part any food produced in Switzerland is organic by default. Combine the two and you get long life.</p><p>
But what made me really skeptical about the diet is something that happened in my family. My father got brain cancer and died at 56, and my mother got breast cancer. Both of my parents were German immigrants and cancer was essentially non-existent in either family tree. About 85% died of a heart attack or old age. I cannot remember any family member who died of cancer.</p><p>
This made me wonder. Why would a family that never had cancer get whacked twice? Maybe it is a statistical outlier. Or maybe there is a problem in the North American diet? My mom when she got breast cancer completely changed her diet and it appears five years and then some later all is ok even though she is living in North America.</p><p>
Makes you think, and it made me change my diet pronto...</p><p>
What is the diet of the Swiss, my mother and I? Easy NO, and I mean NO processed food. Cook from scratch, fresh vegetables, pumper-nickel type bread, reasonable amounts meat, plenty of natural cheese, etc.</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by CyberBrook</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jul 2007 01:16:06 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>we are what we eat<p>I don't like that we're being experimented on, essentially chemicalized and genetically modified by what they put into our seeds, farms, and foods.<p>
I eat veg, so I at least avoid all animals, and I try to eat organic, but most restaurants don't serve it and it's more expensive.<p>
Please visit Eco-Eating at <a href="http://www.brook.com/veg" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.brook.com/veg for where I'm coming from philosophically...

<p>Eco-Eating: Eating as if the Earth Matters
<a href="http://www.brook.com/veg" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.brook.com/veg</a></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>we are what we eat<p>I don't like that we're being experimented on, essentially chemicalized and genetically modified by what they put into our seeds, farms, and foods.<p>
I eat veg, so I at least avoid all animals, and I try to eat organic, but most restaurants don't serve it and it's more expensive.<p>
Please visit Eco-Eating at <a href="http://www.brook.com/veg" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.brook.com/veg for where I'm coming from philosophically...

<p>Eco-Eating: Eating as if the Earth Matters
<a href="http://www.brook.com/veg" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow">http://www.brook.com/veg</a></p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by wiscidea</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jul 2007 08:42:44 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>FYI</strong></p><p>Tom Philpot wrote...</p><p>
&lt;&lt;&lt; But what really got my fevered brain ticking was Denise Curuso's article on changes in gene theory -- specifically, evidence challenging the idea that genes operate in isolation, with each sequence of the DNA tied to a single function. &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
and</p><p>
&lt;&lt;&lt; "To their surprise," Caruso writes, "researchers found that the human genome might not be a 'tidy collection of independent genes' after all, with each sequence linked to a specific function, such as a predisposition to diabetes or heart disease."</p><p>
Instead, she goes on, "genes appear to operate in a complex network, and interact and overlap with one another and other components in ways not fully understood." &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
This is very old news. The notion of DNA not being tied to a single function or multiple genes affecting a single trait was covered in my freshman genetics course over two decades ago. Its okay to be worried about it, but if researchers are surprised, they are either faking it to save their asses or not qualified to work in the area.</p><p>
It is corporate efforts to cover up potential hazards that destroy the possiblity of using this technology for good purposes. They should be ashamed of themselves. It is one more reason for the public to wrestle control over GMOs from corporations.

<p>Forward!</p></p>
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				<p><strong>FYI</strong></p><p>Tom Philpot wrote...</p><p>
&lt;&lt;&lt; But what really got my fevered brain ticking was Denise Curuso's article on changes in gene theory -- specifically, evidence challenging the idea that genes operate in isolation, with each sequence of the DNA tied to a single function. &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
and</p><p>
&lt;&lt;&lt; "To their surprise," Caruso writes, "researchers found that the human genome might not be a 'tidy collection of independent genes' after all, with each sequence linked to a specific function, such as a predisposition to diabetes or heart disease."</p><p>
Instead, she goes on, "genes appear to operate in a complex network, and interact and overlap with one another and other components in ways not fully understood." &gt;&gt;&gt;</p><p>
This is very old news. The notion of DNA not being tied to a single function or multiple genes affecting a single trait was covered in my freshman genetics course over two decades ago. Its okay to be worried about it, but if researchers are surprised, they are either faking it to save their asses or not qualified to work in the area.</p><p>
It is corporate efforts to cover up potential hazards that destroy the possiblity of using this technology for good purposes. They should be ashamed of themselves. It is one more reason for the public to wrestle control over GMOs from corporations.

<p>Forward!</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by Liz Borkowski</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jul 2007 00:24:31 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/7</guid>
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				<p><strong>Another study on problematic fructose effects<p>Yet another piece of evidence that over-reliance on fructose can have health consequences just came out at the American Diabetes Association meeting. Investigators randomly assigned overweight study subjects to drink either a fructose- or glucose-sweetened beverage for 10 weeks, and found that fructose consumption "promoted the development of an atherogenic lioproprotein phenotype and glucose intolerance/insulin resistance."<br>
<a href="http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingCoverage/ADAMeeting/tb/6021" rel="nofollow">http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingCoverage/ADAMeeting/tb ...<p>
In other words, this study suggests that people who are overweight and consume fructose-containing beverages increase their risk of developing heart disease and diabetes. <p>
This was a pretty small study (just 23 subjects), but it's not the only one to suggest that fructose may be problematic for reasons other than just calorie density.</p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Another study on problematic fructose effects<p>Yet another piece of evidence that over-reliance on fructose can have health consequences just came out at the American Diabetes Association meeting. Investigators randomly assigned overweight study subjects to drink either a fructose- or glucose-sweetened beverage for 10 weeks, and found that fructose consumption "promoted the development of an atherogenic lioproprotein phenotype and glucose intolerance/insulin resistance."<br>
<a href="http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingCoverage/ADAMeeting/tb/6021" rel="nofollow">http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingCoverage/ADAMeeting/tb ...<p>
In other words, this study suggests that people who are overweight and consume fructose-containing beverages increase their risk of developing heart disease and diabetes. <p>
This was a pretty small study (just 23 subjects), but it's not the only one to suggest that fructose may be problematic for reasons other than just calorie density.</p></p></a></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Delay And Deny</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jul 2007 04:16:50 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>Wrong Culprit<p><br>
I liked Gretchen Morgenson's piece on how investors are suddenly fleeing risk -- meaning that the stock market boom of the past several years, built on leveraged buyouts, subprime lending, and various forms of dodgy financial engineering, may be be about to unravel.<p>
Well, I'm sure you'd like to think that...but the woes of the stock market over the past 10 years are more attributable to the bicycle riding, green-wearing, tree-loving Google engineers (and Apple and Microsoft) who have used the media and meme-manipulation to kite up their stocks, pulling precious capital away from technology innovators who could help us develop a truly 21st century level of technology.<p>
Add in the propensity of the Federal Reserve to support geriatrics rather than buoyant young engineers tryting to change the world by keeping interest rates unnaturally high and you've got the real culprits at bay.<br>


<p>John Bailo<br>
<a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></br></p></br></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Wrong Culprit<p><br>
I liked Gretchen Morgenson's piece on how investors are suddenly fleeing risk -- meaning that the stock market boom of the past several years, built on leveraged buyouts, subprime lending, and various forms of dodgy financial engineering, may be be about to unravel.<p>
Well, I'm sure you'd like to think that...but the woes of the stock market over the past 10 years are more attributable to the bicycle riding, green-wearing, tree-loving Google engineers (and Apple and Microsoft) who have used the media and meme-manipulation to kite up their stocks, pulling precious capital away from technology innovators who could help us develop a truly 21st century level of technology.<p>
Add in the propensity of the Federal Reserve to support geriatrics rather than buoyant young engineers tryting to change the world by keeping interest rates unnaturally high and you've got the real culprits at bay.<br>


<p>John Bailo<br>
<a href="http://you-read-it-here-first.com" rel="nofollow">You Read It Here First</a></br></p></br></p></p></br></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by GreenEngineer</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jul 2007 07:17:01 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/9</guid>
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				<p><strong>Duh</strong></p><p>I have a number of friends who are university biologists, and some of them work in genetic engineering (of bacteria, for research). &nbsp;To them, the idea of non-separable, non-isolated genes falls firmly in the category of what I like to call "the science of No Duh!". &nbsp;It seems to be widely understood among scientists that the model we have of genetics is broken. However, it's the only model we have, and it sort of works much of the time. &nbsp;So the publication record supports it, engineers use it, and non-technical folks readily believe that it describes what's really going on.</p>
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				<p><strong>Duh</strong></p><p>I have a number of friends who are university biologists, and some of them work in genetic engineering (of bacteria, for research). &nbsp;To them, the idea of non-separable, non-isolated genes falls firmly in the category of what I like to call "the science of No Duh!". &nbsp;It seems to be widely understood among scientists that the model we have of genetics is broken. However, it's the only model we have, and it sort of works much of the time. &nbsp;So the publication record supports it, engineers use it, and non-technical folks readily believe that it describes what's really going on.</p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by Biodiversivist</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 08 Jul 2007 12:10:25 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/edible-media-gene-blues/10</guid>
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				<p><strong>With the advent of quantum theory<p>the original model of atoms has proven to be little more than a cartoon. However, it was sufficient to create atomic weapons and power.

<p>In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. <a href="http://www.poisondarts.net" rel="nofollow">Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world</a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>With the advent of quantum theory<p>the original model of atoms has proven to be little more than a cartoon. However, it was sufficient to create atomic weapons and power.

<p>In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. <a href="http://www.poisondarts.net" rel="nofollow">Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world</a></p></p></strong></p>
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