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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for The Climate Policy Paradigm has reached its endgame]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Jon Rynn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 01:12:34 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Ken, a few questions</strong></p><p>

I'm interested in the "cognitive dissonance" that occurred, or maybe didn't occur, at that conference. &nbsp;One of the things that has been driving me crazy has been the juxtaposition of "the world is going to end" and "change your lightbulbs". It always seemed to me that that was a great way to deflate any emotions -- even anger. &nbsp;On the other hand, we keep getting this mantra of "If we start everyone out with small things they will get to the big things". &nbsp;So were the participants aware of this contradiction?</p><p>
I hate to say it, and I hope I'm not being sectarian, but Gelbspan seems to be a good example of the problem you're talking about. &nbsp;Last I looked, he was proud of the fact that he had consulted with lots of economists and world leaders and came up with a plan of bringing down carbon by so-many-percent per year ( JMG, I don't mean to criticize what you're doing). &nbsp;Why isn't he calling for World War II type action, globally? (and by the way, that was an great metaphor, that helping China would be like helping an ally during war, and doing nothing is like appeasement).</p><p>
I think you're calling for a mass movement (strangely enough, I think Gore was calling for a global movement in his last TED speech, although I don't know what he meant by that). &nbsp;But here's the thing -- I don't see a mass movement happening until global warming is linked integrally with other struggles -- and I think that the key issue is economics, because that links to all of the progressive communities, such as African-American, Latino, women, unions, etc. &nbsp;So the idea of transforming the economy into something sustainable, that yields, not just millions of good jobs, but an entire economy that yields good jobs, becomes imperative, in order to bring millions of people in as a mass base.</p><p>
Is your solution a World-War-II type transformation, complete with most (or a significant amount) of the Federal budget devoted to an economic/environmental transformation? &nbsp;That sounds reasonable to me, just asking.</p><p>


So I'll stop right there for now, great essay.</p>
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				<p><strong>Ken, a few questions</strong></p><p>

I'm interested in the "cognitive dissonance" that occurred, or maybe didn't occur, at that conference. &nbsp;One of the things that has been driving me crazy has been the juxtaposition of "the world is going to end" and "change your lightbulbs". It always seemed to me that that was a great way to deflate any emotions -- even anger. &nbsp;On the other hand, we keep getting this mantra of "If we start everyone out with small things they will get to the big things". &nbsp;So were the participants aware of this contradiction?</p><p>
I hate to say it, and I hope I'm not being sectarian, but Gelbspan seems to be a good example of the problem you're talking about. &nbsp;Last I looked, he was proud of the fact that he had consulted with lots of economists and world leaders and came up with a plan of bringing down carbon by so-many-percent per year ( JMG, I don't mean to criticize what you're doing). &nbsp;Why isn't he calling for World War II type action, globally? (and by the way, that was an great metaphor, that helping China would be like helping an ally during war, and doing nothing is like appeasement).</p><p>
I think you're calling for a mass movement (strangely enough, I think Gore was calling for a global movement in his last TED speech, although I don't know what he meant by that). &nbsp;But here's the thing -- I don't see a mass movement happening until global warming is linked integrally with other struggles -- and I think that the key issue is economics, because that links to all of the progressive communities, such as African-American, Latino, women, unions, etc. &nbsp;So the idea of transforming the economy into something sustainable, that yields, not just millions of good jobs, but an entire economy that yields good jobs, becomes imperative, in order to bring millions of people in as a mass base.</p><p>
Is your solution a World-War-II type transformation, complete with most (or a significant amount) of the Federal budget devoted to an economic/environmental transformation? &nbsp;That sounds reasonable to me, just asking.</p><p>


So I'll stop right there for now, great essay.</p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by BlackBear</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 01:38:06 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Scary, but true</strong></p><p>Here's my 2 cents:</p><p>
In each of the great mobilizations of the american people, they had something to work FOR. They had a goal and a purpose and it was an idea that they could rally around.</p><p>
Environmentalists have often been accused of being utopian and to a certain degree I think that the label is deserved. Scientists are very good at telling people What's Wrong, but as of yet have not been great at the Now What.</p><p>
If we are going to save ourselves and our planet then we need a principled discussion of Now What. I agree with Mr. Ward that we have gotten bogged down with short term goals and tiny victories. We need a well thought out vision of what an Eco-Society would look, smell, and feel like. How would we make decisions about what is good or bad? What guidelines would we use for choosing leaders, businesses, homes, etc?</p><p>
We need this kind of vision more than we need the sad wrangling of politicians trying to get us to shut up already. :)</p>
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				<p><strong>Scary, but true</strong></p><p>Here's my 2 cents:</p><p>
In each of the great mobilizations of the american people, they had something to work FOR. They had a goal and a purpose and it was an idea that they could rally around.</p><p>
Environmentalists have often been accused of being utopian and to a certain degree I think that the label is deserved. Scientists are very good at telling people What's Wrong, but as of yet have not been great at the Now What.</p><p>
If we are going to save ourselves and our planet then we need a principled discussion of Now What. I agree with Mr. Ward that we have gotten bogged down with short term goals and tiny victories. We need a well thought out vision of what an Eco-Society would look, smell, and feel like. How would we make decisions about what is good or bad? What guidelines would we use for choosing leaders, businesses, homes, etc?</p><p>
We need this kind of vision more than we need the sad wrangling of politicians trying to get us to shut up already. :)</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by kmp</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 03:34:19 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>Nice piece<p>Thanks for this - it expresses, much more eloquently than I've been able to, much of my frustration with the environmentalist agenda. We expend a lot of effort bickering about the best way to get where we need to be (free market vs. government regulation, solar, wind &amp; biogas capacity &amp; storage, to nuke or not, cap-and-trade and auction permits, the list goes on and on and on) without having a clear idea of where we need to be. &nbsp;350 ppm? 450? 550? &nbsp;What does life look like in our Earth-friendly future? &nbsp;Is it at all possible to keep my little cottage in the woods, or are cities and walkable, self-supporting towns going to be necessary? &nbsp;Will we need to drive only once/week, or once/month, or not at all? &nbsp;Fly once/year, once a decade or not at all? Can I keep some of the things that are important to me (flying to South Africa for the World Cup) if I make sacrifices in other areas (give up meat, drive less than 1000 miles/year)?<p>
I think there is a disconnect in the analogies to the Marshall Plan and the WWII mobilization of Americans. &nbsp;In those scenarios, we were protecting our way of life; yes, people died at Pearl Harbor, and yes, had the Nazis won the war, many, many Americans would have died. &nbsp;But it does not seem that <strong>life was the primary driver of the threat against us, as much as <strong>liberty - the freedom to chooose how we want to live. &nbsp;Therefore, the sacrifices were acceptable, noble even, because we were protecting our way of life. &nbsp;Environmentalists are not interested in protecting our way of life; in fact, we say that our way of life <strong>must change in order to save the planet. America, the Great Teenager, responds "you're not the boss over me" and digs its heels in - I will drive my SUV until hell freezes over simply because you tell me I can't.<p>
Those of us who are, by now, truly scared about the future of our planet and our very species survival, are fed mixed messages, conflicting advice and a big helping of doom &amp; gloom with no action items to galvanize change. &nbsp;Change your lightbulbs! But realize that individual action won't change anything and we won't save the world by changing our lightbulbs. Lower your carbon footprint! But understand that nothing you do personally has any effect, that any change you do make is not enough, that someone is always less carbon intensive than you (and ready to ridicule you for it) and that it doesn't matter anyway, because political action is the only way to affect real change. &nbsp;Offset your carbon! &nbsp;No, don't offsets are at the best pointless, at worst fradulent. Plant trees! No don't, trees actually warm the globe. &nbsp;So what we are left with as advice from the environmentalists is the annoying vague "political action." Well, elections come around only so often. &nbsp;For those of us who do not actually work in an environmental field, there is only so much time and/or money we can donate to environmentalist NGOs. So we are left with a vague and persistent nausea - we know (and cannot forget, as we are constantly reminded) that the lifestyle changes we have made and the paltry efforts at poliitcal action (email petitions, voting, sending the occasional check) are not nearly enough to stop the devastation of global climate change. &nbsp;But what do we do? What is the plan? What should we be striving towards?<p>
I recently re-read the <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Chronicles-Narnia-Boxed-Set/dp/0064471195/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1211302972&amp;sr=8-2" rel="nofollow">Chronicles of Narnia (inspired by the release of the 2nd movie in the series). I hadn't read them since I was a kid (the books in my box set were marked $1.95; remember those days?). In the last book of the series, The Last Battle, I remember a part that resonated with me: the Last King of Narnia, along with two of the children and a small band of talking beasts, were headed into a desperate battle against an enemy that far outweighed them in strength and numbers. &nbsp;The statement was something along the lines of (paraphrasing) "And the band walked a little taller, stepped a little livelier, there was even a whistle or two to be heard, because people with a plan, even a desperate plan, likely to fail, feel better than those with no plan at all."<p>
<strong>We need a plan. And we need to couch it in terms that Americans understand - protecting our way of life. &nbsp;Not our SUVs, our lawns, our three-times-a-day meat habit, but our <strong>liberty; our right to choose what our life will look like, even in a carbon-free world. &nbsp;Instead of environmentalists being the dreaded parent, telling the teenaged Americans "clean up your carbon, stop eating meat, don't drive so much" we should make global climate change itself the enemy, and not because it will kill off the polar bears or raise sea level in the Phillipines, but because eventually, global climate change will tell us what to do. &nbsp;Always wanted to travel to Asia? Sorry, air travel is now illegal, and the rioting over lack of food, fresh water and energy make that entire region unsafe. &nbsp;Want your kids to go to soccer camp? &nbsp;Well, you can't drive them there, because gas is $30/gallon. The soccer fields have turned to dust because there is no water for irrigation, chemical fertilzers have been outlawed, and increasingly violent weather has eroded the topsoil. Want to bake Grandma a birthday cake? &nbsp;Well, sugar and eggs are pretty hard to come by, not to mention flour, and chocolate is a luxury for the very rich. Fossil-fueled ovens are a thing of the past, but maybe you could figure out how to bake in a solar oven. <p>
You get the picture. &nbsp;The thing is, most Americans perceive that it is environmentalists who want to dictate how we live, and environmentalists who want our lives to look like the above scenarios. &nbsp;What we fail to communicate, is that it is global warming that threatens our way of life; not just our very survival, but our ability to choose how we live. &nbsp;Environmentalists are just the messenger - but so far, we have not been able to avoid being shot.<br>
</br></p></strong></strong></p></a></p></p></strong></strong></strong></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Nice piece<p>Thanks for this - it expresses, much more eloquently than I've been able to, much of my frustration with the environmentalist agenda. We expend a lot of effort bickering about the best way to get where we need to be (free market vs. government regulation, solar, wind &amp; biogas capacity &amp; storage, to nuke or not, cap-and-trade and auction permits, the list goes on and on and on) without having a clear idea of where we need to be. &nbsp;350 ppm? 450? 550? &nbsp;What does life look like in our Earth-friendly future? &nbsp;Is it at all possible to keep my little cottage in the woods, or are cities and walkable, self-supporting towns going to be necessary? &nbsp;Will we need to drive only once/week, or once/month, or not at all? &nbsp;Fly once/year, once a decade or not at all? Can I keep some of the things that are important to me (flying to South Africa for the World Cup) if I make sacrifices in other areas (give up meat, drive less than 1000 miles/year)?<p>
I think there is a disconnect in the analogies to the Marshall Plan and the WWII mobilization of Americans. &nbsp;In those scenarios, we were protecting our way of life; yes, people died at Pearl Harbor, and yes, had the Nazis won the war, many, many Americans would have died. &nbsp;But it does not seem that <strong>life was the primary driver of the threat against us, as much as <strong>liberty - the freedom to chooose how we want to live. &nbsp;Therefore, the sacrifices were acceptable, noble even, because we were protecting our way of life. &nbsp;Environmentalists are not interested in protecting our way of life; in fact, we say that our way of life <strong>must change in order to save the planet. America, the Great Teenager, responds "you're not the boss over me" and digs its heels in - I will drive my SUV until hell freezes over simply because you tell me I can't.<p>
Those of us who are, by now, truly scared about the future of our planet and our very species survival, are fed mixed messages, conflicting advice and a big helping of doom &amp; gloom with no action items to galvanize change. &nbsp;Change your lightbulbs! But realize that individual action won't change anything and we won't save the world by changing our lightbulbs. Lower your carbon footprint! But understand that nothing you do personally has any effect, that any change you do make is not enough, that someone is always less carbon intensive than you (and ready to ridicule you for it) and that it doesn't matter anyway, because political action is the only way to affect real change. &nbsp;Offset your carbon! &nbsp;No, don't offsets are at the best pointless, at worst fradulent. Plant trees! No don't, trees actually warm the globe. &nbsp;So what we are left with as advice from the environmentalists is the annoying vague "political action." Well, elections come around only so often. &nbsp;For those of us who do not actually work in an environmental field, there is only so much time and/or money we can donate to environmentalist NGOs. So we are left with a vague and persistent nausea - we know (and cannot forget, as we are constantly reminded) that the lifestyle changes we have made and the paltry efforts at poliitcal action (email petitions, voting, sending the occasional check) are not nearly enough to stop the devastation of global climate change. &nbsp;But what do we do? What is the plan? What should we be striving towards?<p>
I recently re-read the <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Chronicles-Narnia-Boxed-Set/dp/0064471195/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1211302972&amp;sr=8-2" rel="nofollow">Chronicles of Narnia (inspired by the release of the 2nd movie in the series). I hadn't read them since I was a kid (the books in my box set were marked $1.95; remember those days?). In the last book of the series, The Last Battle, I remember a part that resonated with me: the Last King of Narnia, along with two of the children and a small band of talking beasts, were headed into a desperate battle against an enemy that far outweighed them in strength and numbers. &nbsp;The statement was something along the lines of (paraphrasing) "And the band walked a little taller, stepped a little livelier, there was even a whistle or two to be heard, because people with a plan, even a desperate plan, likely to fail, feel better than those with no plan at all."<p>
<strong>We need a plan. And we need to couch it in terms that Americans understand - protecting our way of life. &nbsp;Not our SUVs, our lawns, our three-times-a-day meat habit, but our <strong>liberty; our right to choose what our life will look like, even in a carbon-free world. &nbsp;Instead of environmentalists being the dreaded parent, telling the teenaged Americans "clean up your carbon, stop eating meat, don't drive so much" we should make global climate change itself the enemy, and not because it will kill off the polar bears or raise sea level in the Phillipines, but because eventually, global climate change will tell us what to do. &nbsp;Always wanted to travel to Asia? Sorry, air travel is now illegal, and the rioting over lack of food, fresh water and energy make that entire region unsafe. &nbsp;Want your kids to go to soccer camp? &nbsp;Well, you can't drive them there, because gas is $30/gallon. The soccer fields have turned to dust because there is no water for irrigation, chemical fertilzers have been outlawed, and increasingly violent weather has eroded the topsoil. Want to bake Grandma a birthday cake? &nbsp;Well, sugar and eggs are pretty hard to come by, not to mention flour, and chocolate is a luxury for the very rich. Fossil-fueled ovens are a thing of the past, but maybe you could figure out how to bake in a solar oven. <p>
You get the picture. &nbsp;The thing is, most Americans perceive that it is environmentalists who want to dictate how we live, and environmentalists who want our lives to look like the above scenarios. &nbsp;What we fail to communicate, is that it is global warming that threatens our way of life; not just our very survival, but our ability to choose how we live. &nbsp;Environmentalists are just the messenger - but so far, we have not been able to avoid being shot.<br>
</br></p></strong></strong></p></a></p></p></strong></strong></strong></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by Tasermons Partner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 05:25:07 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Mobilizations are knee-jerk...</strong></p><p>In each of the great mobilizations of the american people, they had something to work FOR. They had a goal and a purpose and it was an idea that they could rally around.</p><p>
The great mobilizations were also knee-jerk reactions to emotional events.</p><p>
The CCC and the NRA (the National Reform Act- not the gun-totin' hillbilly association) was founded in response to the stock market crash.</p><p>
America didn't enter WW2 until after Pearl Harbor.</p><p>
America didn't care much 'bout terrorism or Afghanistan until after the New York terrorist attacks.</p><p>
America didn't see communist Russia as much of threat until they started testing atomic weapons.</p><p>
With global climate change, it's a bit different beacuse there's not a singular, defining, spectacular, explosive event which can be instantly concrete-linked to it. &nbsp;It happens quickly, but not instantly, and it doesn't include any big explosions or great balls of fire from a giant airplane labeled "global warming".</p><p>
If it did, then they'd be much more passionate 'bout it.</p>
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				<p><strong>Mobilizations are knee-jerk...</strong></p><p>In each of the great mobilizations of the american people, they had something to work FOR. They had a goal and a purpose and it was an idea that they could rally around.</p><p>
The great mobilizations were also knee-jerk reactions to emotional events.</p><p>
The CCC and the NRA (the National Reform Act- not the gun-totin' hillbilly association) was founded in response to the stock market crash.</p><p>
America didn't enter WW2 until after Pearl Harbor.</p><p>
America didn't care much 'bout terrorism or Afghanistan until after the New York terrorist attacks.</p><p>
America didn't see communist Russia as much of threat until they started testing atomic weapons.</p><p>
With global climate change, it's a bit different beacuse there's not a singular, defining, spectacular, explosive event which can be instantly concrete-linked to it. &nbsp;It happens quickly, but not instantly, and it doesn't include any big explosions or great balls of fire from a giant airplane labeled "global warming".</p><p>
If it did, then they'd be much more passionate 'bout it.</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by David Roberts</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 06:39:05 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Kaela,</strong></p><p>Beautifully put.

<p>grist.org</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Kaela,</strong></p><p>Beautifully put.

<p>grist.org</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Steve Bloom</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 06:40:32 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>I know where</strong></p><p>"Where is the gathering of Green Group leadership to plan strategy?"</p><p>
In Washington DC, with the focus on electing Democrats, after which what those Democrats are willing to do will be defined as sufficient progress.</p>
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				<p><strong>I know where</strong></p><p>"Where is the gathering of Green Group leadership to plan strategy?"</p><p>
In Washington DC, with the focus on electing Democrats, after which what those Democrats are willing to do will be defined as sufficient progress.</p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by kmp</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 06:43:17 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>There have been opportunities</strong></p><p>they just haven't been played that way.</p><p>
Look at the outpouring of support in the days &amp; weeks following September 11th: blood banks were overflowing, volunteer lines were jammed, most everyone I knew was desperate to do something, anything to help. &nbsp;</p><p>
What if we'd had a President at the time that told Americans that the attacks were directly related to our Middle East foreign policy, and that our Middle East foreign policy was directly related to our dependence on oil? &nbsp;What if, instead of the War on Terror, we declared War on Oil? &nbsp;What if, instead of slapping magnetic flag decals on our SUVs to show our patriotism, our President told us that the most patriotic thing we could do was <strong>not</strong> drive? What if, instead of launching a war against Iraq, we had invested those billions on dollars into our War on Oil and funneled that money into renewable energy, efficiency standards and transit infrastructure? What if, when millions upon millions of Americans asked "what can we do to help?" our President said "Bike to work. Insulate your home. Buy a hybrid. Plant a garden. Buy organic. &nbsp;Let's do everything in our power to stop funneling money, through our oil consumption, to these terrorist groups."<br>
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				<p><strong>There have been opportunities</strong></p><p>they just haven't been played that way.</p><p>
Look at the outpouring of support in the days &amp; weeks following September 11th: blood banks were overflowing, volunteer lines were jammed, most everyone I knew was desperate to do something, anything to help. &nbsp;</p><p>
What if we'd had a President at the time that told Americans that the attacks were directly related to our Middle East foreign policy, and that our Middle East foreign policy was directly related to our dependence on oil? &nbsp;What if, instead of the War on Terror, we declared War on Oil? &nbsp;What if, instead of slapping magnetic flag decals on our SUVs to show our patriotism, our President told us that the most patriotic thing we could do was <strong>not</strong> drive? What if, instead of launching a war against Iraq, we had invested those billions on dollars into our War on Oil and funneled that money into renewable energy, efficiency standards and transit infrastructure? What if, when millions upon millions of Americans asked "what can we do to help?" our President said "Bike to work. Insulate your home. Buy a hybrid. Plant a garden. Buy organic. &nbsp;Let's do everything in our power to stop funneling money, through our oil consumption, to these terrorist groups."<br>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Anna Haynes</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 11:33:49 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/8</guid>
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				<p><strong>On second reading, I see...<p>...that this post is about what environmental organizations' leadership should do, not about what independent citizens should do.<p>
For the record I agree 100% with this from Ken's 2007 <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2007/4/18/111843/339" rel="nofollow">The chasm between our agenda and climate science: The problem statement -<p>
"Why do we [environmental organizations] continue, in our materials and on our web sites, to present climate as one of any number of apparently equally important issues? Why, if we really believe that the fate of the world will be decided within a few years, haven't our organizations liquidated assets, shut down non-essential program and invested everything in one final effort? Why, given the crushing circumstances, is there essentially no internal debate or challenge to our inadequate course of action?"<p>
I used to belong to every group under the sun, but I'm no longer supporting any environmental organization, for this very reason - their actions and communications don't evince good judgment.<p>
But coming back to the level of personal actions, what about the Cafe attendees in the folding chairs, what should they do, what role do you envision for them - is their only outlet still going to be "give money, write letters and vote"?<p>
(we have the web now, we want freedom, not discipline)<p>
- Anna, still reading through last year's Bright Lines <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2007/2/6/171750/4623" rel="nofollow">series</a></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>On second reading, I see...<p>...that this post is about what environmental organizations' leadership should do, not about what independent citizens should do.<p>
For the record I agree 100% with this from Ken's 2007 <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2007/4/18/111843/339" rel="nofollow">The chasm between our agenda and climate science: The problem statement -<p>
"Why do we [environmental organizations] continue, in our materials and on our web sites, to present climate as one of any number of apparently equally important issues? Why, if we really believe that the fate of the world will be decided within a few years, haven't our organizations liquidated assets, shut down non-essential program and invested everything in one final effort? Why, given the crushing circumstances, is there essentially no internal debate or challenge to our inadequate course of action?"<p>
I used to belong to every group under the sun, but I'm no longer supporting any environmental organization, for this very reason - their actions and communications don't evince good judgment.<p>
But coming back to the level of personal actions, what about the Cafe attendees in the folding chairs, what should they do, what role do you envision for them - is their only outlet still going to be "give money, write letters and vote"?<p>
(we have the web now, we want freedom, not discipline)<p>
- Anna, still reading through last year's Bright Lines <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2007/2/6/171750/4623" rel="nofollow">series</a></p></p></p></p></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #9 by F James Handley</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 12:48:23 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Carbon Tax &amp; Dividend<p>YES! The disconnect between the escalating climate crisis and the current discussions about solutions is fearfully vast. &nbsp;The old tools of environmental protection (e.g., regulations or emissions trading) can't provide the impetus for a shift as deep and wide as we must all make. &nbsp; <p>
What would it take to shift the entire economy (and those of our trading partners) briskly away from fossil fuels (especially carbon-intensive coal) towards conservation and renewables and make that shift quickly and efficiently as possible? &nbsp; <p>
That signal is the price of carbon. &nbsp;Climate scientists have reached near-unanimity on the problem. &nbsp;Economists are converging on the first necessary step in the solution: PRICE CARBON EMISSIONS OR DIE! &nbsp;<p>
The simplest and clearest price signal: A GRADUALLY-INCREASING CARBON TAX, revenue-neutral, with revenues paid in equal dividends to everyone. &nbsp;That would make EVERYONE who spends money a GHG reductions enteprenuer by rewarding those who reduce emissions.<p>
Yale Prof. Nordhaus offers this test: Proposals to change light bulbs, raise fuel efficiency standards and ethanol subsidies miss the fundamental economic lesson: "RAISING THE PRICE OF CARBON IS A NECESSARY STEP FOR TACKLING GLOBAL WARMING." The rest, he says, is "largely fluff."<p>
For more on revenue-neutral carbon taxes, see <a href="http://www.carbontax.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.carbontax.org. &nbsp;<p>
&nbsp; &nbsp;</p></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Carbon Tax &amp; Dividend<p>YES! The disconnect between the escalating climate crisis and the current discussions about solutions is fearfully vast. &nbsp;The old tools of environmental protection (e.g., regulations or emissions trading) can't provide the impetus for a shift as deep and wide as we must all make. &nbsp; <p>
What would it take to shift the entire economy (and those of our trading partners) briskly away from fossil fuels (especially carbon-intensive coal) towards conservation and renewables and make that shift quickly and efficiently as possible? &nbsp; <p>
That signal is the price of carbon. &nbsp;Climate scientists have reached near-unanimity on the problem. &nbsp;Economists are converging on the first necessary step in the solution: PRICE CARBON EMISSIONS OR DIE! &nbsp;<p>
The simplest and clearest price signal: A GRADUALLY-INCREASING CARBON TAX, revenue-neutral, with revenues paid in equal dividends to everyone. &nbsp;That would make EVERYONE who spends money a GHG reductions enteprenuer by rewarding those who reduce emissions.<p>
Yale Prof. Nordhaus offers this test: Proposals to change light bulbs, raise fuel efficiency standards and ethanol subsidies miss the fundamental economic lesson: "RAISING THE PRICE OF CARBON IS A NECESSARY STEP FOR TACKLING GLOBAL WARMING." The rest, he says, is "largely fluff."<p>
For more on revenue-neutral carbon taxes, see <a href="http://www.carbontax.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.carbontax.org. &nbsp;<p>
&nbsp; &nbsp;</p></a></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #10 by hapa</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 15:52:11 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>plan</strong></p><p>

draw up a national grid proposal, with pretty maps, that plays to the distributed strengths of renewable energy. even if it's the european super-grid proposal traced onto a kids' wooden USA puzzle it would be better than "our target should be 20-60% in no less than 25 years, if practical." it's practical. the obstacles, as ralph nader recently put it, are "non-technical."</p><p>
stop talking about climate as though it were separate from groundwater supplies, fisheries, credit shortages, falling wages, and anything else big going on now. this is all part of one big resource-management screwup and no part alone can be fixed without the others drawing it back into the red.</p><p>
yes to jon rynn. the fact that this changes the economic picture for billions of people -- for the bad if we quit, for the good of we try -- shows that it's a real story worth telling. A WORLD-ROUND MOBILIZATION MEANS THERE WILL BE TONS OF WORK. some will work in bad faith and screw things up. that will take watching. some will work on whatever, not caring why. that's totally okay. you need to take a step back if you think of this as saving souls. the first business of any good religion is to help with the daily chores.</p><p>
stop harshing on the lightbulb message -- we all know it's huge -- one of the biggest changes we can make. worthy of law, including practical disposal preparations. instead, go get mad at the "check your tire pressure" people. driving with a lighter, steadier foot, closer to the speed limit, would get most people 20-30% better gas mileage. part of being serious means we scrub out the tips that don't work and concentrate on the good ones. (i'd give a kidney if this otherwise wasted election eon could be used to teach people about embodied energy and the other core concepts of smartening up our equipment buys.)</p><p>
start talking about complications of implementation. say, "okay, we're working on building our wind power, and that's good, but we're already outgrowing the grid we have and we may have some raw materials problems -- the answer to which is probably recycling more of our current deadweight, faster. let's figure out what we'll be tossing and see if deconstructing it gets us closer to our materials needs."</p><p>
never show fear to a camera. tell people what will happen. a contraction of one industry, growth in others. tell them washington's job now is not to tell nature what to do or legislate science, it's to divide the work effectively, thoughtfully, attentively, and fairly. we can save our dirty industries from getting beat by the new and clean, or we can save our beloved planet. people know polluting businesses have been living on borrowed time and political favoritism. they just need to know they have a way out that isn't marked "bankruptcy."</p><p>
for luck, because we need it, and that's actually an optimistic point of view.</p><p>
work from a plan. if you don't like lester brown's numbers, say why. if they're okay, show them to people, talk about how they're practical, how they are economical and create wealth and opportunities while blowing the doors off the polluters' estimates of how fast we can afford to change.</p><p>
get used to saying the word "trillion." it's a big number because there are a lot of us and together we make a big economy. but the money all shifts from other places. we can afford to be amazing.

</p>
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				<p><strong>plan</strong></p><p>

draw up a national grid proposal, with pretty maps, that plays to the distributed strengths of renewable energy. even if it's the european super-grid proposal traced onto a kids' wooden USA puzzle it would be better than "our target should be 20-60% in no less than 25 years, if practical." it's practical. the obstacles, as ralph nader recently put it, are "non-technical."</p><p>
stop talking about climate as though it were separate from groundwater supplies, fisheries, credit shortages, falling wages, and anything else big going on now. this is all part of one big resource-management screwup and no part alone can be fixed without the others drawing it back into the red.</p><p>
yes to jon rynn. the fact that this changes the economic picture for billions of people -- for the bad if we quit, for the good of we try -- shows that it's a real story worth telling. A WORLD-ROUND MOBILIZATION MEANS THERE WILL BE TONS OF WORK. some will work in bad faith and screw things up. that will take watching. some will work on whatever, not caring why. that's totally okay. you need to take a step back if you think of this as saving souls. the first business of any good religion is to help with the daily chores.</p><p>
stop harshing on the lightbulb message -- we all know it's huge -- one of the biggest changes we can make. worthy of law, including practical disposal preparations. instead, go get mad at the "check your tire pressure" people. driving with a lighter, steadier foot, closer to the speed limit, would get most people 20-30% better gas mileage. part of being serious means we scrub out the tips that don't work and concentrate on the good ones. (i'd give a kidney if this otherwise wasted election eon could be used to teach people about embodied energy and the other core concepts of smartening up our equipment buys.)</p><p>
start talking about complications of implementation. say, "okay, we're working on building our wind power, and that's good, but we're already outgrowing the grid we have and we may have some raw materials problems -- the answer to which is probably recycling more of our current deadweight, faster. let's figure out what we'll be tossing and see if deconstructing it gets us closer to our materials needs."</p><p>
never show fear to a camera. tell people what will happen. a contraction of one industry, growth in others. tell them washington's job now is not to tell nature what to do or legislate science, it's to divide the work effectively, thoughtfully, attentively, and fairly. we can save our dirty industries from getting beat by the new and clean, or we can save our beloved planet. people know polluting businesses have been living on borrowed time and political favoritism. they just need to know they have a way out that isn't marked "bankruptcy."</p><p>
for luck, because we need it, and that's actually an optimistic point of view.</p><p>
work from a plan. if you don't like lester brown's numbers, say why. if they're okay, show them to people, talk about how they're practical, how they are economical and create wealth and opportunities while blowing the doors off the polluters' estimates of how fast we can afford to change.</p><p>
get used to saying the word "trillion." it's a big number because there are a lot of us and together we make a big economy. but the money all shifts from other places. we can afford to be amazing.

</p>
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            <title>Comment #11 by Bill McKibben</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 22:41:14 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>350</strong></p><p>Interesting post as always.</p><p>
One slight correction. Jim Hansen's announcement that 350 is the new number has not been met with an entirely deafening silence. Those of us who ran the domestic StepItUp effort last year have now started a global campaign, 350.org, which will officially launch next month but has already organized actions in a dozen states and a dozen countries, and been widely discussed in major articles in the LA Times and Washington Post. If I was better at linking, I'd send you to the piece that originated last week at tomdispatch.com, and was carried widely around the blogosphere, including in Grist. In any event, you can check out the website at 350.org, and more to the point you can help join in the battle. Not easy to do, a global movement, but at least we're trying (and in 14 languages!).</p>
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				<p><strong>350</strong></p><p>Interesting post as always.</p><p>
One slight correction. Jim Hansen's announcement that 350 is the new number has not been met with an entirely deafening silence. Those of us who ran the domestic StepItUp effort last year have now started a global campaign, 350.org, which will officially launch next month but has already organized actions in a dozen states and a dozen countries, and been widely discussed in major articles in the LA Times and Washington Post. If I was better at linking, I'd send you to the piece that originated last week at tomdispatch.com, and was carried widely around the blogosphere, including in Grist. In any event, you can check out the website at 350.org, and more to the point you can help join in the battle. Not easy to do, a global movement, but at least we're trying (and in 14 languages!).</p>
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            <title>Comment #12 by lorna salzman</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 20 May 2008 22:47:48 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Ken Ward on policy and power</strong></p><p>Ken Ward is, as usual, perspicacious and brutally honest in his assessment, in particular his keen insight : that policy is preceded by power. Many activists talk about building that "broad consensus" that they assume will create this power. But so far few have proposed anything more than the usual interim short -term "coalition building", based on the assumption that all progressives in all movements think and evaluate the same and share the same objectives. This is a sad delusion, underscored by the internal conflicts within the Democratic Party, presumed home base for liberals and everyone who isn't a Republican. &nbsp;What is overlooked is this simple fact: that even though the environment has not taken priority in voter's choices, &nbsp;there are literally tens of millions of citizens who support, directly and indirectly, environmental causes and organizations, who cut across economic and class lines, and who are the most likely segment of society to be sympathetic to an uncompromising and militant approach to global warming. Instead of a scattershot approach - appealing to the general public or the elites - we should spend our time and money to recruit this base to an undiluted campaign against global warming. And this campaign would directly address the issue of power, through a demonstrably effective mechanism: the PAC. If every one of these 20 million voters gave $10, we would have $200 million dollars to run those candidates who pledge to support a tough &nbsp;energy policy that includes ending coal, terminating all fossil and nuclear subsidies, imposing carbon taxes, and imposing mandatory efficiency standards across the economy, as well as stopping deforestation, expanding &nbsp;affordable regional and national passenger rail, and even placing a Border Tax Adjustment on tax carbon-intensive imports. The PAC could both run candidates in key districts and selectively endorse incumbents who support this plan. Some wealthy benefactors might be persuaded to match the PAC-raised funds, thus doubling the intake. Focus should be on the U.S. Senate rather than the House of Representatives, because it would take far more effort to obtain a majority in the House than in the Senate, and getting a green senator onto Capitol Hill means six years of opportunity. &nbsp;This kind of message to the supposed progressives in congress would be like a pail of cold water on the heads of those Democrats who take the liberal vote for granted by assuming liberals and independents have nowhere else to go. What a powerful statement....and what a giant step toward getting the power that is needed to radically change our energy policy.</p>
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				<p><strong>Ken Ward on policy and power</strong></p><p>Ken Ward is, as usual, perspicacious and brutally honest in his assessment, in particular his keen insight : that policy is preceded by power. Many activists talk about building that "broad consensus" that they assume will create this power. But so far few have proposed anything more than the usual interim short -term "coalition building", based on the assumption that all progressives in all movements think and evaluate the same and share the same objectives. This is a sad delusion, underscored by the internal conflicts within the Democratic Party, presumed home base for liberals and everyone who isn't a Republican. &nbsp;What is overlooked is this simple fact: that even though the environment has not taken priority in voter's choices, &nbsp;there are literally tens of millions of citizens who support, directly and indirectly, environmental causes and organizations, who cut across economic and class lines, and who are the most likely segment of society to be sympathetic to an uncompromising and militant approach to global warming. Instead of a scattershot approach - appealing to the general public or the elites - we should spend our time and money to recruit this base to an undiluted campaign against global warming. And this campaign would directly address the issue of power, through a demonstrably effective mechanism: the PAC. If every one of these 20 million voters gave $10, we would have $200 million dollars to run those candidates who pledge to support a tough &nbsp;energy policy that includes ending coal, terminating all fossil and nuclear subsidies, imposing carbon taxes, and imposing mandatory efficiency standards across the economy, as well as stopping deforestation, expanding &nbsp;affordable regional and national passenger rail, and even placing a Border Tax Adjustment on tax carbon-intensive imports. The PAC could both run candidates in key districts and selectively endorse incumbents who support this plan. Some wealthy benefactors might be persuaded to match the PAC-raised funds, thus doubling the intake. Focus should be on the U.S. Senate rather than the House of Representatives, because it would take far more effort to obtain a majority in the House than in the Senate, and getting a green senator onto Capitol Hill means six years of opportunity. &nbsp;This kind of message to the supposed progressives in congress would be like a pail of cold water on the heads of those Democrats who take the liberal vote for granted by assuming liberals and independents have nowhere else to go. What a powerful statement....and what a giant step toward getting the power that is needed to radically change our energy policy.</p>
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            <title>Comment #13 by Ken Ward</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 May 2008 03:54:31 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>response to posts...</strong></p><p>Great set of responses. Seems to me, all whining in my posts aside, that we (Grist posters) are making some strides towards carving out a conversation on the fundamental challenges. <br>
In no particular order:</p><p>


re: Bill MicKibben's post. Definitely didn't mean to imply that there has been no response to Hansen. Bill's eloquent and dogged effort to draw attention to the 350 benchmark is the most visible and effective. But I think that Bill's organizing in Step it Up and 350 prove the point. Climate activists groping for some point of certainty in the welter of partial goals and small-scale solutions (nicely described by kmp) must look to new efforts like 350, because there is no clarity in major environmental organizations' and foundations' program.</p><p>
re: John Ryan #1. Cognitive dissonance, as I understand it in reference to climate, has several overlapping meanings: 1. The state of anxiety felt by an individual confronted by evidence which conflicts with belief; thus, the uncomfortable feelings of participants in low carbon footprint workshops who who believe that personal action is important and will rank household recycling and purchase of a Prius high on a list of climate action activities, but are also fully aware that carbon emissions reductions through their own, and like-minded peoples' efforts are essentially meaningless; 2. Sub-conscious processes the mind employs to resolve such conflict, particularly screening out or downplaying information which conflicts with belief. This, I think, describes the state of most professional staff working on climate, who are fully aware of the latest science, but unconsciously screen out, or do not access that information as they go about their day-to-day work), and; 3. Taking action that is contrary to belief and/or conforming one's beliefs to fit with actions one is unwilling or unable to change. This, it seems to me, describes the condition of many knowledgeable people working in the private sector, particularly oil, gas and coal companies.</p><p>


In my view, our greatest problem is #2., because it is the continuing ability of of environmental staff and leaders to suit up and keep plugging away at an ineffectual agenda that prevents us from rewriting the environmentalist climate story and refocusing our climate agenda, to offer activists in #1 a way out and put the folks in #3 under increasing strain. Cognitive dissonance, in other worlds, is our stumbling block and also our best tool. </p><p>
That's the theory. What actually goes through an individual's mind is, of course, idiosyncratic, but I have listened to many people, from senior staff attorneys to my dentist, describe strikingly similar experiences of existential panic. These intense, mildly dissociative states seem to occur most frequently during commutes, on waking or attempting to fall asleep, and sometimes in breaks during the work day - lulls in the stream of orderly thought. The trigger may be a stray piece of information, an image, or (for a lot of people) a sudden burst of anxiety over the future of their kids or grandchildren. The feeling is difficult to describe - one friend said she felt as though her body was suddenly empty, an echoing hollow between her hips and shoulders. Most people also experience shortness of breath.<br>
I think what's going on is that our fight-or-flight reflexes are kicking in at odd moments, and the problem with our climate agenda - at this very primal level - is that we neither address the feeling, nor offer an opportunity to fight or flee.</p><p>
In the unfolding WWII analogy, our story speaks in the language of Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain, whose response to Hitler was...<br>
... by all means in our power to avoid war, by analyzing possible causes, by trying to remove them, by discussion in a spirit of collaboration and goodwill,"</p><p>
To break free of our own cognitive dissonance and energize our core, we must rally and fight (flight is not an option), as Winston Churchill did for Britain...<br>
...we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender."</p><p>


re: John Ryan #2. Neither Ross Gelbspan, nor Bill McKibben, nor any of several other outstanding efforts to draw a bright line and craft a functional solution - see, especially, David Merrill's work at StopGlobalWarming.org and Tom Athan ___ - should be compared to our major organizations and foundations. The difference in resources is gargantuan - a handful of hardworking people, with little or no funding, entirely reliant on volunteer action by individuals and coalitions versus $1 billion in assets dedicated to climate, memberships in the millions, and professional staff in the thousands. The fact that Ross's work is seen in the same terms as, say, the Pew Climate Center, demonstrates a huge disparity in cost-effectiveness, but the bottom line is that Ross and others similarly positioned have limited options if they want to advance a pragmatic solution. McKibben's campaigns aim to shift the balance of power, and in my opinion, the 350 effort will be more useful, because it advances Hansen's bright line, than Step it Up, which called for US domestic emissions reductions alone.</p><p>
re: John Ryan #3. Gore's thinking remains an enigma. On the one hand, as John notes, he does speak in terms of a movement and has called for direction action, but when it comes to spending money, he invests in "We" commercials which are almost the antithesis. Movements and protest are launched by small groups of deeply committed people who crystallize a moral question and polarize options between black and white. <br>


This forces the majority, who will otherwise be perfectly content with shades of grey, to make a choice.</p><p>
I keep turning to the example of slavery in the early half of the `19th century as the best example of how an issue that is accommodated within pluralistic politics can be pole-vaulted to the defining question before the nation. Northern abolitionist groups of the era, like environmentalists now, were large, well financed and able to move limited-aim bills in Congress. They were also committed to incremental change, split into many competing organizations, and spent a good deal of time and energy debating alternative policies - slaves should be returned o Africa, freed, but not made citizens, given their own territory/reservation, and so on. John Brown's raid on Harper's Ferry failed raise a slave rebellion, but Brown's moral absolutism, brilliantly publicized by Emerson and Thoreau, put both Southern slavers and Northern abolitionists on the road to emancipation and rebellion.</p><p>


re: John Ryan #4. Sure, I don't see how we avert catastrophe otherwise, and I have an optimistic view of America and Americans, that in clutch, we will do the right and pragmatic thing. The fact that we are not now willing to come to grips with the crisis is consistent with how Americans have always acted, but our nation as a unique ability to shift gears very quickly, and will do so again on climate. Don't get me wrong, this is not an argument to sit on our hands and wait for some future political crisis. But it does argue that our present focus on convincing the majority that we have a problem, while being careful not to scare them too much, is misguided. Rather, we should be focusing on building the base of flat-out committed climate activists, heightening conflict, and polarizing climate between two mutually exclusive visions.</p><p>
re:kmp. I agree completely. I thought the most dispiriting aspect of the debate over Cape Wind was the fact that all arguments, pro and con, were in the abstract. The bottom line question - is Nantucket Sound so unique an environmental and aesthetic treasure that it trumps climate action? - can only be answered if we have some idea, even a guesstimate, of how much wind power we must generate and where, to meet this objective, Nantucket Sound falls on the list of sites.</p><p>
re: lifestyle. I'm not convinced that Americans must make significant changes in lifestyle - at least to reduce fossil fuel use, we may well be forced to make major changes to deal with climate change impacts. It's all a matter of scale and power. If the US government, acting with the same alacrity and pragmatism of post-Pearl Harbor, simply mandated 60 mpg vehicles, phase-down of fossil fuel electricity generation, and required solar retrofits for building heating, we would be in striking distance of self-sufficiency, without any cultural change of significance. </p><p>


The idea that environmentalism is only about setting limits and our image as crabby meddlers, intent on making life less fun, is not one we should accept or perpetuate. Somewhere along the line we stopped thinking and talking about environmentalism in terms of freedom from want, intelligent design, and simple-but-elegant solutions. Remember Amory Lovins describing nuclear power as "cutting butter with a chainsaw"?</p><p>
Shellenberger and Nordhaus are half right in arguing that we must celebrate the vision of sustainability. After all, the rest of the world is fighting to become what we are. They are naive, I think, in arguing that emphasizing the positive alone is sufficient.</p><p>
8. re: Tasermons Partner. I don't think we should discount the possibility of one galvanizing climate impact or a sequence. Part of our problem is that in describing climate change as a host of impacts without differentiation, we make is difficult to grasp the problem as something we can fix. But there is one big problem - the ice shelves and sea level rise - that will be "spectacular."</p><p>
It already is, but we're not doing much to draw attention to it. The breakup of the Wilkins ice shelf in March of this year, 30 years earlier than the leading expert predicted, is very sobering and ought to have been banner line news in our communications.</p><p>
9. re: Anna, Lorna, &nbsp;hapa, Handley on what do we do? Good suggestions all. I feel that the key issue here, though, is how our organizations and the foundations which support us, define the agenda. I don't see that there is time to construct an alternative. This is nettlesome, in that there is little to offer frustrated activists, and at the same time relatively straightforward. It is our institution and if we cannot imagine reworking our own approach, why should we hold out any hope of changing America?

<p>Ken Ward
ken[at]brightlines.org</p></br></br></br></br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>response to posts...</strong></p><p>Great set of responses. Seems to me, all whining in my posts aside, that we (Grist posters) are making some strides towards carving out a conversation on the fundamental challenges. <br>
In no particular order:</p><p>


re: Bill MicKibben's post. Definitely didn't mean to imply that there has been no response to Hansen. Bill's eloquent and dogged effort to draw attention to the 350 benchmark is the most visible and effective. But I think that Bill's organizing in Step it Up and 350 prove the point. Climate activists groping for some point of certainty in the welter of partial goals and small-scale solutions (nicely described by kmp) must look to new efforts like 350, because there is no clarity in major environmental organizations' and foundations' program.</p><p>
re: John Ryan #1. Cognitive dissonance, as I understand it in reference to climate, has several overlapping meanings: 1. The state of anxiety felt by an individual confronted by evidence which conflicts with belief; thus, the uncomfortable feelings of participants in low carbon footprint workshops who who believe that personal action is important and will rank household recycling and purchase of a Prius high on a list of climate action activities, but are also fully aware that carbon emissions reductions through their own, and like-minded peoples' efforts are essentially meaningless; 2. Sub-conscious processes the mind employs to resolve such conflict, particularly screening out or downplaying information which conflicts with belief. This, I think, describes the state of most professional staff working on climate, who are fully aware of the latest science, but unconsciously screen out, or do not access that information as they go about their day-to-day work), and; 3. Taking action that is contrary to belief and/or conforming one's beliefs to fit with actions one is unwilling or unable to change. This, it seems to me, describes the condition of many knowledgeable people working in the private sector, particularly oil, gas and coal companies.</p><p>


In my view, our greatest problem is #2., because it is the continuing ability of of environmental staff and leaders to suit up and keep plugging away at an ineffectual agenda that prevents us from rewriting the environmentalist climate story and refocusing our climate agenda, to offer activists in #1 a way out and put the folks in #3 under increasing strain. Cognitive dissonance, in other worlds, is our stumbling block and also our best tool. </p><p>
That's the theory. What actually goes through an individual's mind is, of course, idiosyncratic, but I have listened to many people, from senior staff attorneys to my dentist, describe strikingly similar experiences of existential panic. These intense, mildly dissociative states seem to occur most frequently during commutes, on waking or attempting to fall asleep, and sometimes in breaks during the work day - lulls in the stream of orderly thought. The trigger may be a stray piece of information, an image, or (for a lot of people) a sudden burst of anxiety over the future of their kids or grandchildren. The feeling is difficult to describe - one friend said she felt as though her body was suddenly empty, an echoing hollow between her hips and shoulders. Most people also experience shortness of breath.<br>
I think what's going on is that our fight-or-flight reflexes are kicking in at odd moments, and the problem with our climate agenda - at this very primal level - is that we neither address the feeling, nor offer an opportunity to fight or flee.</p><p>
In the unfolding WWII analogy, our story speaks in the language of Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain, whose response to Hitler was...<br>
... by all means in our power to avoid war, by analyzing possible causes, by trying to remove them, by discussion in a spirit of collaboration and goodwill,"</p><p>
To break free of our own cognitive dissonance and energize our core, we must rally and fight (flight is not an option), as Winston Churchill did for Britain...<br>
...we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender."</p><p>


re: John Ryan #2. Neither Ross Gelbspan, nor Bill McKibben, nor any of several other outstanding efforts to draw a bright line and craft a functional solution - see, especially, David Merrill's work at StopGlobalWarming.org and Tom Athan ___ - should be compared to our major organizations and foundations. The difference in resources is gargantuan - a handful of hardworking people, with little or no funding, entirely reliant on volunteer action by individuals and coalitions versus $1 billion in assets dedicated to climate, memberships in the millions, and professional staff in the thousands. The fact that Ross's work is seen in the same terms as, say, the Pew Climate Center, demonstrates a huge disparity in cost-effectiveness, but the bottom line is that Ross and others similarly positioned have limited options if they want to advance a pragmatic solution. McKibben's campaigns aim to shift the balance of power, and in my opinion, the 350 effort will be more useful, because it advances Hansen's bright line, than Step it Up, which called for US domestic emissions reductions alone.</p><p>
re: John Ryan #3. Gore's thinking remains an enigma. On the one hand, as John notes, he does speak in terms of a movement and has called for direction action, but when it comes to spending money, he invests in "We" commercials which are almost the antithesis. Movements and protest are launched by small groups of deeply committed people who crystallize a moral question and polarize options between black and white. <br>


This forces the majority, who will otherwise be perfectly content with shades of grey, to make a choice.</p><p>
I keep turning to the example of slavery in the early half of the `19th century as the best example of how an issue that is accommodated within pluralistic politics can be pole-vaulted to the defining question before the nation. Northern abolitionist groups of the era, like environmentalists now, were large, well financed and able to move limited-aim bills in Congress. They were also committed to incremental change, split into many competing organizations, and spent a good deal of time and energy debating alternative policies - slaves should be returned o Africa, freed, but not made citizens, given their own territory/reservation, and so on. John Brown's raid on Harper's Ferry failed raise a slave rebellion, but Brown's moral absolutism, brilliantly publicized by Emerson and Thoreau, put both Southern slavers and Northern abolitionists on the road to emancipation and rebellion.</p><p>


re: John Ryan #4. Sure, I don't see how we avert catastrophe otherwise, and I have an optimistic view of America and Americans, that in clutch, we will do the right and pragmatic thing. The fact that we are not now willing to come to grips with the crisis is consistent with how Americans have always acted, but our nation as a unique ability to shift gears very quickly, and will do so again on climate. Don't get me wrong, this is not an argument to sit on our hands and wait for some future political crisis. But it does argue that our present focus on convincing the majority that we have a problem, while being careful not to scare them too much, is misguided. Rather, we should be focusing on building the base of flat-out committed climate activists, heightening conflict, and polarizing climate between two mutually exclusive visions.</p><p>
re:kmp. I agree completely. I thought the most dispiriting aspect of the debate over Cape Wind was the fact that all arguments, pro and con, were in the abstract. The bottom line question - is Nantucket Sound so unique an environmental and aesthetic treasure that it trumps climate action? - can only be answered if we have some idea, even a guesstimate, of how much wind power we must generate and where, to meet this objective, Nantucket Sound falls on the list of sites.</p><p>
re: lifestyle. I'm not convinced that Americans must make significant changes in lifestyle - at least to reduce fossil fuel use, we may well be forced to make major changes to deal with climate change impacts. It's all a matter of scale and power. If the US government, acting with the same alacrity and pragmatism of post-Pearl Harbor, simply mandated 60 mpg vehicles, phase-down of fossil fuel electricity generation, and required solar retrofits for building heating, we would be in striking distance of self-sufficiency, without any cultural change of significance. </p><p>


The idea that environmentalism is only about setting limits and our image as crabby meddlers, intent on making life less fun, is not one we should accept or perpetuate. Somewhere along the line we stopped thinking and talking about environmentalism in terms of freedom from want, intelligent design, and simple-but-elegant solutions. Remember Amory Lovins describing nuclear power as "cutting butter with a chainsaw"?</p><p>
Shellenberger and Nordhaus are half right in arguing that we must celebrate the vision of sustainability. After all, the rest of the world is fighting to become what we are. They are naive, I think, in arguing that emphasizing the positive alone is sufficient.</p><p>
8. re: Tasermons Partner. I don't think we should discount the possibility of one galvanizing climate impact or a sequence. Part of our problem is that in describing climate change as a host of impacts without differentiation, we make is difficult to grasp the problem as something we can fix. But there is one big problem - the ice shelves and sea level rise - that will be "spectacular."</p><p>
It already is, but we're not doing much to draw attention to it. The breakup of the Wilkins ice shelf in March of this year, 30 years earlier than the leading expert predicted, is very sobering and ought to have been banner line news in our communications.</p><p>
9. re: Anna, Lorna, &nbsp;hapa, Handley on what do we do? Good suggestions all. I feel that the key issue here, though, is how our organizations and the foundations which support us, define the agenda. I don't see that there is time to construct an alternative. This is nettlesome, in that there is little to offer frustrated activists, and at the same time relatively straightforward. It is our institution and if we cannot imagine reworking our own approach, why should we hold out any hope of changing America?

<p>Ken Ward
ken[at]brightlines.org</p></br></br></br></br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #14 by Jon Rynn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 May 2008 05:16:11 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>On culture change<p>Ken, thanks for the long and reasoned reply.<p>
As for how much Americans will have to change if we want to reverse global warming, I think the problem falls into two general groupings:<p>
1) I think the change in transportation and where people live may require large-scale changes, and I think this is the biggest problem, at least with the general public. &nbsp;A lot of this depends, I think, on how the electric car develops. &nbsp;I would much prefer if everybody lived in walkable town and city centers; but (obviously) I would prefer to mitigate global warming if that can be achieved while preserving sprawl, because that would be much easier to accomplish.<p>
So will it be necessary for Americans to live in (nice) apartments in town and city centers, with mostly train, bike, and walking?<p>
On the other hand, changing the way electricity is generated and distributed could conceivably not involve much in the way of culture change -- although I think buildings will have to become much more efficient and <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/2/18/212538/864" rel="nofollow">generate much of their own energy, because that's not a big culture change -- but it leads to the next big problem<p>
2) taking on power centers. &nbsp;Big coal is obviously not going to like a switch to renewables, and utilities won't like distributed renewable generation (probably), and the military will want to keep its huge budget, and the rich and powerful will not want their taxes raised to a fair level, and car companies will not like a switch to trains (or even electric cars), and Republicans will want to preserve suburbia (and scream bloody murder if people argue against it). &nbsp;<p>
Which brings us back to your original idea, Ken, of building alternative power centers, without which the pressure to transform the society -- much less undertake World War -style programs -- probably won't take place.</p></p></a></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>On culture change<p>Ken, thanks for the long and reasoned reply.<p>
As for how much Americans will have to change if we want to reverse global warming, I think the problem falls into two general groupings:<p>
1) I think the change in transportation and where people live may require large-scale changes, and I think this is the biggest problem, at least with the general public. &nbsp;A lot of this depends, I think, on how the electric car develops. &nbsp;I would much prefer if everybody lived in walkable town and city centers; but (obviously) I would prefer to mitigate global warming if that can be achieved while preserving sprawl, because that would be much easier to accomplish.<p>
So will it be necessary for Americans to live in (nice) apartments in town and city centers, with mostly train, bike, and walking?<p>
On the other hand, changing the way electricity is generated and distributed could conceivably not involve much in the way of culture change -- although I think buildings will have to become much more efficient and <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/2/18/212538/864" rel="nofollow">generate much of their own energy, because that's not a big culture change -- but it leads to the next big problem<p>
2) taking on power centers. &nbsp;Big coal is obviously not going to like a switch to renewables, and utilities won't like distributed renewable generation (probably), and the military will want to keep its huge budget, and the rich and powerful will not want their taxes raised to a fair level, and car companies will not like a switch to trains (or even electric cars), and Republicans will want to preserve suburbia (and scream bloody murder if people argue against it). &nbsp;<p>
Which brings us back to your original idea, Ken, of building alternative power centers, without which the pressure to transform the society -- much less undertake World War -style programs -- probably won't take place.</p></p></a></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #15 by tboggia</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 May 2008 06:08:01 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Don't know the economics but...<p>When Detroit was asked to produce tanks, the federal government spent lots of money on them. They had a guaranteed return on investment, and they could essentially charge the Government however much they wanted. The situation is kinda different now.<p>
Anyways, there is a movement growing, with a strong stance, that goes beyond the numbers and addresses all issues of justice mentioned above. This is the Energy Action Coalition with or new Youth Climate Pledge [<a href="http://action.energyactioncoalition.org//o/614/t/5737/signUp.jsp?key=3252" rel="nofollow">http://action.energyactioncoalition.org//o/614/t/5737/sig ...]

<p>Focus the Nation on January 31st 2008</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Don't know the economics but...<p>When Detroit was asked to produce tanks, the federal government spent lots of money on them. They had a guaranteed return on investment, and they could essentially charge the Government however much they wanted. The situation is kinda different now.<p>
Anyways, there is a movement growing, with a strong stance, that goes beyond the numbers and addresses all issues of justice mentioned above. This is the Energy Action Coalition with or new Youth Climate Pledge [<a href="http://action.energyactioncoalition.org//o/614/t/5737/signUp.jsp?key=3252" rel="nofollow">http://action.energyactioncoalition.org//o/614/t/5737/sig ...]

<p>Focus the Nation on January 31st 2008</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #16 by Jon Rynn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 21 May 2008 06:33:45 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>tboggia,</strong></p><p>your program looks very interesting, but is anybody putting more details into your various proposals? &nbsp;</p>
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				<p><strong>tboggia,</strong></p><p>your program looks very interesting, but is anybody putting more details into your various proposals? &nbsp;</p>
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            <title>Comment #17 by RisingTideNA</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Sun, 25 May 2008 15:12:12 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Question to Ken</strong></p><p>Ken, I think this is a great essay, and was suprised you mentioned Rising Tide for criticism here since I think (?) you'd find most people active in our (100% volunteer network) agree with virtually all of what you said - perhaps I'm missing something, but I don't believe we fit with any of your criticisms.</p><p>
Were you were saying that our "program" [sic!] is too removed from "climate 24-7" because we believe that the environment can not be viewed in isolation of human oppression - especially when fossil fuel extraction and burning is involved? </p><p>
It would suprise me to hear that conflicts with your argument, but it's all I can think of...</p><p>
I just not sure what you were getting and and was genuinely curious.</p><p>
thanks for the article...

<p>www.RisingTideNorthAmerica.org</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Question to Ken</strong></p><p>Ken, I think this is a great essay, and was suprised you mentioned Rising Tide for criticism here since I think (?) you'd find most people active in our (100% volunteer network) agree with virtually all of what you said - perhaps I'm missing something, but I don't believe we fit with any of your criticisms.</p><p>
Were you were saying that our "program" [sic!] is too removed from "climate 24-7" because we believe that the environment can not be viewed in isolation of human oppression - especially when fossil fuel extraction and burning is involved? </p><p>
It would suprise me to hear that conflicts with your argument, but it's all I can think of...</p><p>
I just not sure what you were getting and and was genuinely curious.</p><p>
thanks for the article...

<p>www.RisingTideNorthAmerica.org</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #18 by bobclive</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 28 May 2008 00:29:05 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Early warning signs at the Global Warming Café</strong></p><p>To be able to see signs of global warming linked to CO2 you need two things (1) accurate CO2 data and (2) accurate temperature data. There is accurate CO2 data but only since 1958 at Mauna Loa, as for temperature, well there are thousands of high quality rural weather stations throughout the world and especially in the US and the northern hemisphere that have long histories and NO UHI bias. These stations are totally uncontaminated and provide temperature data from a totally natural environment like Mauna Loa does for CO2.</p><p>
What do warmers such as Hanson/Giss do, well, they use station pairs and compare data from a highly UHI contaminated urban city weather station with CLEAN data from a neighbouring RURAL station. They then Use some secret algorithm put all the data through a computer which then gives them the result in degrees C. The odd thing is that the result always shows a steep rising temperature trend when the neighbouring RURAL CLEAN data shows only a flat or a slightly rising temperature trend.</p><p>
Would it not have been more logical to have discarded the contaminated data from the Urban stations and used only the clean data from the Rural sites. I believe the answer to this is that this method would not allow the easy fiddling of data.</p><p>
The Hanson method,<br>
Bad data + good data = very good data because it shows rising temperatures, this is called Hansonisation.</p><p>
Good data from RURAL weather stations = &nbsp;NO link between CO2 and temperature rise and we don`t want that do we.<br>
</br></br></p>
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				<p><strong>Early warning signs at the Global Warming Café</strong></p><p>To be able to see signs of global warming linked to CO2 you need two things (1) accurate CO2 data and (2) accurate temperature data. There is accurate CO2 data but only since 1958 at Mauna Loa, as for temperature, well there are thousands of high quality rural weather stations throughout the world and especially in the US and the northern hemisphere that have long histories and NO UHI bias. These stations are totally uncontaminated and provide temperature data from a totally natural environment like Mauna Loa does for CO2.</p><p>
What do warmers such as Hanson/Giss do, well, they use station pairs and compare data from a highly UHI contaminated urban city weather station with CLEAN data from a neighbouring RURAL station. They then Use some secret algorithm put all the data through a computer which then gives them the result in degrees C. The odd thing is that the result always shows a steep rising temperature trend when the neighbouring RURAL CLEAN data shows only a flat or a slightly rising temperature trend.</p><p>
Would it not have been more logical to have discarded the contaminated data from the Urban stations and used only the clean data from the Rural sites. I believe the answer to this is that this method would not allow the easy fiddling of data.</p><p>
The Hanson method,<br>
Bad data + good data = very good data because it shows rising temperatures, this is called Hansonisation.</p><p>
Good data from RURAL weather stations = &nbsp;NO link between CO2 and temperature rise and we don`t want that do we.<br>
</br></br></p>
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            <title>Comment #19 by Ken Ward</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 09 Jun 2008 02:17:56 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Rising Tide</strong></p><p>I goofed. I had listed Rising Tide with other organizations, based on a stray reference to Green Jobs, but neglected to read through the wealth of material on their site. Though I do not think there is time for any effort that aims to challenge capitalism, racism and patriarchy along with climate, Rising Tide is certainly no product of the Climate Policy Paradigm! My apologies. Ken

<p>Ken Ward
ken[at]brightlines.org</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Rising Tide</strong></p><p>I goofed. I had listed Rising Tide with other organizations, based on a stray reference to Green Jobs, but neglected to read through the wealth of material on their site. Though I do not think there is time for any effort that aims to challenge capitalism, racism and patriarchy along with climate, Rising Tide is certainly no product of the Climate Policy Paradigm! My apologies. Ken

<p>Ken Ward
ken[at]brightlines.org</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #20 by CHANGEpartner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 04:05:36 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Early Warning Signs @ Global Warming Cafe<p>Ken:<p>
Your post reminded me of Werbach's recent <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/4/11/153519/830m" rel="nofollow">Blue speech. &nbsp;You're both saying that we've been working on "saving" the environment for 30+ years, and we're worse off now than when we started. &nbsp;We have to change, and fast, if we're going to get to 350 or 450 ppm.<p>
At heart, I think you're talking about <strong> leverage and <strong>scale. &nbsp;If we have to take significant action soon to avoid the climate change "tipping point" then we need to focus on those few actions that will produce the most meaningful change in the shortest time...leverage. &nbsp;And we need to figure out how to engage a critical mass of key people who can facilitate true change...scale.<p>
Experts and laypeople both have thoughts about how to achieve leverage and scale. &nbsp;For example, Vinod Khosla, a green VC guru, says we've got to address <a href="http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/127/a-devilish-green-angel.html" rel="nofollow"> "Oil, Coal, Cement and Steel" . And the US Energy Information Administration has reams of data about the largest (US) sources of greenhouse gases. &nbsp;We know the technical aspects of the climate change problem we have to address to get leverage.<p>
What we need to do a much better job of, as you point out, is identifying the how to gain leverage on the social side, i.e. how we can cause massive, quick behavior and attitude change.<p>
The good news is that we in the Organizational Development community have been doing this for years in organizations. And there are many fields of research and practice, such as Community Based Social Marketing, which can inform our efforts to go to scale with consumers, business people, politicians, etc., &nbsp;What's needed is a focus on these factors, as opposed to the technical aspects of climate change. &nbsp;<p>
Your post is starting to point us in the right direction, in focusing on these non-technical aspects of the environmental movement. I think the real question is, how to we get some key organizations/people to work on this stuff? &nbsp;

<p>CHANGEpartner</p></p></p></p></a></p></strong></strong></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Early Warning Signs @ Global Warming Cafe<p>Ken:<p>
Your post reminded me of Werbach's recent <a href="http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/4/11/153519/830m" rel="nofollow">Blue speech. &nbsp;You're both saying that we've been working on "saving" the environment for 30+ years, and we're worse off now than when we started. &nbsp;We have to change, and fast, if we're going to get to 350 or 450 ppm.<p>
At heart, I think you're talking about <strong> leverage and <strong>scale. &nbsp;If we have to take significant action soon to avoid the climate change "tipping point" then we need to focus on those few actions that will produce the most meaningful change in the shortest time...leverage. &nbsp;And we need to figure out how to engage a critical mass of key people who can facilitate true change...scale.<p>
Experts and laypeople both have thoughts about how to achieve leverage and scale. &nbsp;For example, Vinod Khosla, a green VC guru, says we've got to address <a href="http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/127/a-devilish-green-angel.html" rel="nofollow"> "Oil, Coal, Cement and Steel" . And the US Energy Information Administration has reams of data about the largest (US) sources of greenhouse gases. &nbsp;We know the technical aspects of the climate change problem we have to address to get leverage.<p>
What we need to do a much better job of, as you point out, is identifying the how to gain leverage on the social side, i.e. how we can cause massive, quick behavior and attitude change.<p>
The good news is that we in the Organizational Development community have been doing this for years in organizations. And there are many fields of research and practice, such as Community Based Social Marketing, which can inform our efforts to go to scale with consumers, business people, politicians, etc., &nbsp;What's needed is a focus on these factors, as opposed to the technical aspects of climate change. &nbsp;<p>
Your post is starting to point us in the right direction, in focusing on these non-technical aspects of the environmental movement. I think the real question is, how to we get some key organizations/people to work on this stuff? &nbsp;

<p>CHANGEpartner</p></p></p></p></a></p></strong></strong></p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #21 by david lewis</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/early-warning-signs-at-the-global-warming-caf/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 17:13:37 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>until Hansen spoke up it was difficult</strong></p><p>I put returning the composition of the atmosphere back to the preindustrial, i.e. 280 ppm in the policy books of the Green Party of British Columbia about twenty years ago, got elected as a Speaker of that party when they had three Speakers instead of a Leader, and went out campaigning for a brief period as if the party took that policy seriously. &nbsp;I quickly found out that the serious environmental campaigners were all working for other political parties as the Greens were regarded as not having a chance in hell to elect anyone. &nbsp;I campaigned saying that these environmentalists were legitimizing politics that would kill the planet by allying themselves to political organizations that had no climate policy at all and quickly found out how isolated you could become if you took the position I had taken. &nbsp;I was condemned throughout British Columbia as "insane" and "dangerous" because if people voted for the Green Party to indicate they supported our climate policy, they would be opposing all these other environmentalists who had sold out any chance of making climate debate a reality back then in order to get a few more parks established. &nbsp; The Greens themselves couldn't understand why all these reputable people were condemning me and support for me in my position evaporated. &nbsp;I resigned eventually. &nbsp;</p><p>
No scientist at that time was advocating that civilization stablize the composition of the atmosphere and remove some of the greenhouse gases it contained to restore it anywhere near the preindustrial, so all I had to back up my position was that I could state that I had met a few top flight climatologists and I knew they would support what I was saying even though they would not call for it themselves. &nbsp;I eventually despaired of this getting anywhere and I've not done that much, until recently when I heard Hansen was saying 350 ppm. &nbsp;</p><p>
Now, finally, after twenty years, there are some scientists calling for action commensurate with the level of threat they've been describing all this time. &nbsp;They've always been precise and unrestrained when describing what level of threat global warming represents: &nbsp;in 1988 the Toronto Changing Atmosphere conference of 400 high level delegates had no trouble agreeing on describing the threat as one that could only be exceeded "by global nuclear war", whereas their call for action would be laughable today. &nbsp;</p><p>
So I would say that I found myself isolated and powerless in the past doing exactly what you are calling for now, but that there are new possibilities now that some scientists are on board in this way. &nbsp;I never saw the point in saying anything other than the truth as I saw it. &nbsp; The truth just might start working for people now. &nbsp;

<p>david lewis</p></p>
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				<p><strong>until Hansen spoke up it was difficult</strong></p><p>I put returning the composition of the atmosphere back to the preindustrial, i.e. 280 ppm in the policy books of the Green Party of British Columbia about twenty years ago, got elected as a Speaker of that party when they had three Speakers instead of a Leader, and went out campaigning for a brief period as if the party took that policy seriously. &nbsp;I quickly found out that the serious environmental campaigners were all working for other political parties as the Greens were regarded as not having a chance in hell to elect anyone. &nbsp;I campaigned saying that these environmentalists were legitimizing politics that would kill the planet by allying themselves to political organizations that had no climate policy at all and quickly found out how isolated you could become if you took the position I had taken. &nbsp;I was condemned throughout British Columbia as "insane" and "dangerous" because if people voted for the Green Party to indicate they supported our climate policy, they would be opposing all these other environmentalists who had sold out any chance of making climate debate a reality back then in order to get a few more parks established. &nbsp; The Greens themselves couldn't understand why all these reputable people were condemning me and support for me in my position evaporated. &nbsp;I resigned eventually. &nbsp;</p><p>
No scientist at that time was advocating that civilization stablize the composition of the atmosphere and remove some of the greenhouse gases it contained to restore it anywhere near the preindustrial, so all I had to back up my position was that I could state that I had met a few top flight climatologists and I knew they would support what I was saying even though they would not call for it themselves. &nbsp;I eventually despaired of this getting anywhere and I've not done that much, until recently when I heard Hansen was saying 350 ppm. &nbsp;</p><p>
Now, finally, after twenty years, there are some scientists calling for action commensurate with the level of threat they've been describing all this time. &nbsp;They've always been precise and unrestrained when describing what level of threat global warming represents: &nbsp;in 1988 the Toronto Changing Atmosphere conference of 400 high level delegates had no trouble agreeing on describing the threat as one that could only be exceeded "by global nuclear war", whereas their call for action would be laughable today. &nbsp;</p><p>
So I would say that I found myself isolated and powerless in the past doing exactly what you are calling for now, but that there are new possibilities now that some scientists are on board in this way. &nbsp;I never saw the point in saying anything other than the truth as I saw it. &nbsp; The truth just might start working for people now. &nbsp;

<p>david lewis</p></p>
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