<![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for Farming bluefins not an answer to overfishing]]> Grist Comment Feed en Comment #1 by josullivan58 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:01:13 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/1 Just eat lower on the food chain

Ranched tuna is like clean coal and light cigarettes. They're all bad.

]]> Just eat lower on the food chain

Ranched tuna is like clean coal and light cigarettes. They're all bad.

]]> Comment #2 by Sam Wells http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:23:16 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/2 Agreed

The NMFS has or had big plans for farming all kinds of fish including tuna, such as in huge cages anchored off the coastline of the US. It really doesn't work except as for holding pens, like how they process industrial cattle. The largest holding pens are in the Mediterranean Sea actually, and there are none in the US yet.

What was done to the blue fin tuna was despicable and beyond comprehension. The US has at least tried to limit catches and prohibit catches in the breeding grounds of the Gulf of Mexico. I cannot say that for any other foreign country, as far as conservation.

Those creative Australians of course want recognition for the "holy grail" of wild reproduction, breeding blue fin tuna. It is an interesting breakthrough, like mapping the DNA of the Tasmanian Devil. But for commercial applications or as a solution to conservation, it totally sucks.  -sammie

Onward through the fog

]]> Agreed

The NMFS has or had big plans for farming all kinds of fish including tuna, such as in huge cages anchored off the coastline of the US. It really doesn't work except as for holding pens, like how they process industrial cattle. The largest holding pens are in the Mediterranean Sea actually, and there are none in the US yet.

What was done to the blue fin tuna was despicable and beyond comprehension. The US has at least tried to limit catches and prohibit catches in the breeding grounds of the Gulf of Mexico. I cannot say that for any other foreign country, as far as conservation.

Those creative Australians of course want recognition for the "holy grail" of wild reproduction, breeding blue fin tuna. It is an interesting breakthrough, like mapping the DNA of the Tasmanian Devil. But for commercial applications or as a solution to conservation, it totally sucks.  -sammie

Onward through the fog

]]> Comment #3 by Pangolin http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:30:14 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/3 Head banging idiocy

Didn't wild bluefin evolve over millions of years the ability to migrate to where the little fish are, eat them, and then become big fish. All without an ounce of human assistance.

Now, due to the age of cheap fuel, tuna stocks are declining. With the cheap fuel age over we are using fuel to go catch food for the tuna, freeze it, then transport it to captive fish. This is supposed to be preferable to simply setting fishing quotas that will allow stocks to grow and enforcing them.

What part of "sustainable" includes the massive burning of fossil fuels to farm fish? That can't be sustainable for long.

Put the Carbon Back

]]> Head banging idiocy

Didn't wild bluefin evolve over millions of years the ability to migrate to where the little fish are, eat them, and then become big fish. All without an ounce of human assistance.

Now, due to the age of cheap fuel, tuna stocks are declining. With the cheap fuel age over we are using fuel to go catch food for the tuna, freeze it, then transport it to captive fish. This is supposed to be preferable to simply setting fishing quotas that will allow stocks to grow and enforcing them.

What part of "sustainable" includes the massive burning of fossil fuels to farm fish? That can't be sustainable for long.

Put the Carbon Back

]]> Comment #4 by suzannah http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:10:54 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/4 ranching = even worse overfishing

Not to mention pollution from fish waste destroying ocean floor habitats, cramped conditions leading to disease, escaped fish that compete and interbreed with wild fish, rampant antibiotic use leading to increased bacteria resistance ... the list goes on.

I haven't yet read Ellis' book, but I'll be very disappointed if he really believes that ranching is a viable answer in any way. That is a crucial misunderstanding of the issue on his part.

Oceana: Protecting the world's oceans.

]]> ranching = even worse overfishing

Not to mention pollution from fish waste destroying ocean floor habitats, cramped conditions leading to disease, escaped fish that compete and interbreed with wild fish, rampant antibiotic use leading to increased bacteria resistance ... the list goes on.

I haven't yet read Ellis' book, but I'll be very disappointed if he really believes that ranching is a viable answer in any way. That is a crucial misunderstanding of the issue on his part.

Oceana: Protecting the world's oceans.

]]> Comment #5 by suzannah http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:16:34 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/5 and....

As it takes up to 10 pounds of wild fish to create one pound of farmed salmon, imagine how much wild fish it'll take to fatten the much larger, more robust bluefin tunas.

Oceana: Protecting the world's oceans.

]]> and....

As it takes up to 10 pounds of wild fish to create one pound of farmed salmon, imagine how much wild fish it'll take to fatten the much larger, more robust bluefin tunas.

Oceana: Protecting the world's oceans.

]]> Comment #6 by Erik Hoffner http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:32:45 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/6 Clean Seas

"I'll be very disappointed if he really believes that ranching is a viable answer in any way."

Unfortunately, Ellis seems to take a little too much heart from the Clean Seas announcement, also evident later in this interview he did on Food Chain radio recently, "Show #601: BLUEFIN: COCAINE OF THE SEAS"

http://www.foodchainradio.com/shows/601BAbluefin.mp3

Erik

The Orion Grassroots Network: supporting grassroots groups working for conservation, justice, & more

]]> Clean Seas

"I'll be very disappointed if he really believes that ranching is a viable answer in any way."

Unfortunately, Ellis seems to take a little too much heart from the Clean Seas announcement, also evident later in this interview he did on Food Chain radio recently, "Show #601: BLUEFIN: COCAINE OF THE SEAS"

http://www.foodchainradio.com/shows/601BAbluefin.mp3

Erik

The Orion Grassroots Network: supporting grassroots groups working for conservation, justice, & more

]]> Comment #7 by Biodiversivist http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:02:19 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/7 Sushi is for losers ...

...too clueless to realize that the consumption of wildlife (ocean fish in this case) is tantamount to eating buffalo tongues and passenger pigeon pie at the turn of the century. Spread the meme.

The analogy is when humanity penned and domesticated wild cattle and sheep. Essentially we are starting to turn the wild oceans (think buffalo on the wild plains) into grazing lands with domesticated animals jammed into feedlots awaiting slaughter.

Penned tuna will rapidly evolve into a domesticated farm animal. The only thing that will be roaming the oceans will be the fish equivalent of cows.

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world

]]> Sushi is for losers ...

...too clueless to realize that the consumption of wildlife (ocean fish in this case) is tantamount to eating buffalo tongues and passenger pigeon pie at the turn of the century. Spread the meme.

The analogy is when humanity penned and domesticated wild cattle and sheep. Essentially we are starting to turn the wild oceans (think buffalo on the wild plains) into grazing lands with domesticated animals jammed into feedlots awaiting slaughter.

Penned tuna will rapidly evolve into a domesticated farm animal. The only thing that will be roaming the oceans will be the fish equivalent of cows.

In the end, it all comes down to biodiversity. Poison Darts--Protecting the biodiversity of our world

]]> Comment #8 by caniscandida http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:20:51 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/8 Ellis's blind spot is surprising

It is surprising that someone with as keen an interest in preserving biodiversity as Richard Ellis would make such a grave oversight.

The rather skimpy Wikipedia article suggests that he has studied biodiversity-related issues for some time:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ellis_(biologist)

A number of years ago, I heard him lecture at the American Museum of Natural History, on the subject of Mesozoic marine reptiles (e.g. ichthyosaurs, plesiosaurs, mosasaurs), in connexion with his book "Sea Dragons."  And I corresponded with him a couple of times on subjects in paleontology and evolutionary biology.  He strikes me as learned, affable, friendly, entertaining, and engaging.

On the other hand, I know nothing about what name he may have among environmentalists of the school of E.O. Wilson.

Chickens deserve our true friendship! So do fish! So do other sentient beings! Let us learn to be kind.

]]> Ellis's blind spot is surprising

It is surprising that someone with as keen an interest in preserving biodiversity as Richard Ellis would make such a grave oversight.

The rather skimpy Wikipedia article suggests that he has studied biodiversity-related issues for some time:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Ellis_(biologist)

A number of years ago, I heard him lecture at the American Museum of Natural History, on the subject of Mesozoic marine reptiles (e.g. ichthyosaurs, plesiosaurs, mosasaurs), in connexion with his book "Sea Dragons."  And I corresponded with him a couple of times on subjects in paleontology and evolutionary biology.  He strikes me as learned, affable, friendly, entertaining, and engaging.

On the other hand, I know nothing about what name he may have among environmentalists of the school of E.O. Wilson.

Chickens deserve our true friendship! So do fish! So do other sentient beings! Let us learn to be kind.

]]> Comment #9 by Erik Hoffner http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/ Thu, 20 Nov 2008 03:07:16 -0800 http://www.grist.org/article/down-on-the-tuna-ranch/9 oversights

Biodiversivist, you go a little far there in your critique of those who eat from the ocean. As someone who catches and eats a dozen (or more, if I can manage it) striped bass and bluefish every year from the Atlantic, my sense is that these healthy populations can take some minor weeding from myself. And there are other sustaining populations of ocean critters, too, as you well know. Don't paint too broadly with your meme.

Canis: yes, his coffee table book on whales in the 70s I read over and over. A classic, and the illustrations are so beautiful. His last book, The Empty Ocean, seemed more hip to food chain issues, too.

Erik

The Orion Grassroots Network: supporting grassroots groups working for conservation, justice, & more

]]> oversights

Biodiversivist, you go a little far there in your critique of those who eat from the ocean. As someone who catches and eats a dozen (or more, if I can manage it) striped bass and bluefish every year from the Atlantic, my sense is that these healthy populations can take some minor weeding from myself. And there are other sustaining populations of ocean critters, too, as you well know. Don't paint too broadly with your meme.

Canis: yes, his coffee table book on whales in the 70s I read over and over. A classic, and the illustrations are so beautiful. His last book, The Empty Ocean, seemed more hip to food chain issues, too.

Erik

The Orion Grassroots Network: supporting grassroots groups working for conservation, justice, & more

]]>