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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for For some farmers, distant markets offer the best prices]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Rural Populist</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:59:40 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p><strong>Distance v. Class<p>Seventy-five miles doesn't strike me as the problem. That is remarkably "local" given today's food system. Rather, and as you indicate, the problem is disparate wealth. This has bothered me for years.<p>
We have seen renewed food systems that we cheer come into existence in recent years, but we too often fail to acknowledge that the growing gap between the rich and the poor is precisely what has made this possible. <p>
Who doesn't love a <a href="http://www.nimanranch.com/control/category/~category_id=farmer01" rel="nofollow">Niman Ranch hog farmer? But these farmers that we love to love produce meat for high-end markets on the coasts. Is it better than producing hogs in confinement for export or growing corn for unmitigated biofuels production? Certainly. <p>
But a local food system that caters to and relies upon a growing wealth disparity leaves too many of the social ills that we set out to address untouched. </p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Distance v. Class<p>Seventy-five miles doesn't strike me as the problem. That is remarkably "local" given today's food system. Rather, and as you indicate, the problem is disparate wealth. This has bothered me for years.<p>
We have seen renewed food systems that we cheer come into existence in recent years, but we too often fail to acknowledge that the growing gap between the rich and the poor is precisely what has made this possible. <p>
Who doesn't love a <a href="http://www.nimanranch.com/control/category/~category_id=farmer01" rel="nofollow">Niman Ranch hog farmer? But these farmers that we love to love produce meat for high-end markets on the coasts. Is it better than producing hogs in confinement for export or growing corn for unmitigated biofuels production? Certainly. <p>
But a local food system that caters to and relies upon a growing wealth disparity leaves too many of the social ills that we set out to address untouched. </p></a></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Bart Anderson</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:17:35 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/2</guid>
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				<p><strong>Brighter future for small farmers?<p>Great post, Ariane and Stephanie. You've really hit on something -- the mismatch between the idea of "buy/sell locally" and market realities.<p>
I think a common thread in the history of agriculture is that farmers depend on transport networks to reach customers. On the one hand, we have the highly organized global food system, with the problems that Gristmill readers know about.<p>
On the other hand, we have the theoretically beautiful idea of buying locally. As you say, most farmers can't make it by selling just at the nearby farmers market. &nbsp;I think most of the vendors at our farmers market come from at least 75 miles away (we are in expensive Silicon Valley).<p>
The other problem is that taking goods to farmers markets is a big investment in time and fuel. As some critics of local food point out, farmers driving trucks to markets is not an efficient way to transport goods.<p>
I'll bet there will be the growth of an intermediate food transport/distribution system. &nbsp;Perhaps local wholesalers. There were solutions in the past and I'm sure we will re-discover them in time.<p>
The other thing I'm thinking is that several trends are working in favor of small, local farmers.<p>


The trend in favor of local and organic foods. The fashion will expand from the urban elite to rural and less affluent consumers, just as previous food trends have (for example, white bread and processed foods). <p>
Continued increases in the price of fuel should make processed food and long-distance food chains less viable. <p>
Continued increases in the price of fertilizers should favor organic producers who use compost.<p>
Food will probably continue to rise in price, ensuring better prices for produce.<p>
Suspicion of food from unknown sources is growing, as regulation and inspection break down.<p>
Real estate prices should not continue upwards, as the r-e bubble continues to burst. Farmland should see a decrease in competition from housing -- high fuel costs mean that &nbsp;developments outside of easy commuting distance are dropping in value.<p>


From what I can see, the future for small farmers looks brighter than it has for a while. But conditions are changing fast, and it may take some adroit maneuvering to deal with them.<p>
Does this correspond to what you are seeing?

<p>Bart<br>
<a href="http://energybulletin.net" rel="nofollow">Energy Bulletin</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>Brighter future for small farmers?<p>Great post, Ariane and Stephanie. You've really hit on something -- the mismatch between the idea of "buy/sell locally" and market realities.<p>
I think a common thread in the history of agriculture is that farmers depend on transport networks to reach customers. On the one hand, we have the highly organized global food system, with the problems that Gristmill readers know about.<p>
On the other hand, we have the theoretically beautiful idea of buying locally. As you say, most farmers can't make it by selling just at the nearby farmers market. &nbsp;I think most of the vendors at our farmers market come from at least 75 miles away (we are in expensive Silicon Valley).<p>
The other problem is that taking goods to farmers markets is a big investment in time and fuel. As some critics of local food point out, farmers driving trucks to markets is not an efficient way to transport goods.<p>
I'll bet there will be the growth of an intermediate food transport/distribution system. &nbsp;Perhaps local wholesalers. There were solutions in the past and I'm sure we will re-discover them in time.<p>
The other thing I'm thinking is that several trends are working in favor of small, local farmers.<p>


The trend in favor of local and organic foods. The fashion will expand from the urban elite to rural and less affluent consumers, just as previous food trends have (for example, white bread and processed foods). <p>
Continued increases in the price of fuel should make processed food and long-distance food chains less viable. <p>
Continued increases in the price of fertilizers should favor organic producers who use compost.<p>
Food will probably continue to rise in price, ensuring better prices for produce.<p>
Suspicion of food from unknown sources is growing, as regulation and inspection break down.<p>
Real estate prices should not continue upwards, as the r-e bubble continues to burst. Farmland should see a decrease in competition from housing -- high fuel costs mean that &nbsp;developments outside of easy commuting distance are dropping in value.<p>


From what I can see, the future for small farmers looks brighter than it has for a while. But conditions are changing fast, and it may take some adroit maneuvering to deal with them.<p>
Does this correspond to what you are seeing?

<p>Bart<br>
<a href="http://energybulletin.net" rel="nofollow">Energy Bulletin</a></br></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by caniscandida</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:39:02 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/3</guid>
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				<p><strong>FYI: women farmers in the Northeast<p>Here is a not altogether irrelevant article from Sunday's New York Times Magazine, about diversified small farms run by remarkably intelligent and inspired women in a few states hereabouts:<p>
<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/13/magazine/13food-t-001.html?_r=1&amp;ref=magazine&amp;oref=slogin." rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/13/magazine/13food-t-001.h ...

<p>Chickens deserve our true friendship!  So do fish!  So do other sentient beings!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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				<p><strong>FYI: women farmers in the Northeast<p>Here is a not altogether irrelevant article from Sunday's New York Times Magazine, about diversified small farms run by remarkably intelligent and inspired women in a few states hereabouts:<p>
<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/13/magazine/13food-t-001.html?_r=1&amp;ref=magazine&amp;oref=slogin." rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/13/magazine/13food-t-001.h ...

<p>Chickens deserve our true friendship!  So do fish!  So do other sentient beings!  Let us learn to be kind.</p></a></p></p></strong></p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by Wolverine</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 02:21:51 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/4</guid>
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				<p><strong>Local Is The ONLY Way To Go</strong></p><p>Long distance produce, like long distance anything, is just part of the problem. &nbsp;But by today's U.S. standards, anything within the same county is certainly local, and some would say anything within 100 miles is local. &nbsp;As long as we're using harmful industrial means to transport things, the definition of "local" needs to be narrowed, but this is a good start.</p>
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				<p><strong>Local Is The ONLY Way To Go</strong></p><p>Long distance produce, like long distance anything, is just part of the problem. &nbsp;But by today's U.S. standards, anything within the same county is certainly local, and some would say anything within 100 miles is local. &nbsp;As long as we're using harmful industrial means to transport things, the definition of "local" needs to be narrowed, but this is a good start.</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by Stephanie Ogburn</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jul 2008 15:37:58 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/5</guid>
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				<p><strong>Distance v. Class</strong></p><p>Rural Populist: I agree about distance v. class and I think the distance I'm writing about is more a function of class than miles. (Telluride seems legions away when one lives down in the Montezuma Valley in Cortez, but I think that is because there's absolutely no reason to go up there unless one is wealthy.) This post used the distance of 75 miles as a proxy for class, really.</p><p>
Bart: I'm not sure if I am seeing the same thing as you are in terms of real estate prices. The area where I live seems somewhat on track to become the next Phoenix. The land value hikes seems to be caused in large part by the relatively wealthy buying up land as retirement/second homes. That trend, at least locally, seems remarkably unaffected by this recent economic downturn.</p><p>
And I don't see more people at farmers' market here because of the recent health scares, interestingly enough. We're just so rural -- often I think people here feel unaffected by what's going on in the world at large. I do think the situation will drastically change, though, as oil prices rise. I am just unsure how it will change. It will be interesting to watch. Gas hit $4.17 a gallon here at the cheapest station just yesterday.</p><p>
My ideal while I'm here, though, is to help make healthy local food available to regular folks. At the moment, this pretty much entails getting it into schools in the form of breakfasts and lunches, (a project that's consuming a fair bit of my nonworking time right now) and making it more available at convenient markets, from grocery stores to farmers' market. Additionally, the farmer I work for is trying a number of strategies to get herself out there into markets where normal people shop, and this diversified approach may yield some good results. I'll probably have more posts on on that at a later date.

<p>Stephanie</p></p>
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				<p><strong>Distance v. Class</strong></p><p>Rural Populist: I agree about distance v. class and I think the distance I'm writing about is more a function of class than miles. (Telluride seems legions away when one lives down in the Montezuma Valley in Cortez, but I think that is because there's absolutely no reason to go up there unless one is wealthy.) This post used the distance of 75 miles as a proxy for class, really.</p><p>
Bart: I'm not sure if I am seeing the same thing as you are in terms of real estate prices. The area where I live seems somewhat on track to become the next Phoenix. The land value hikes seems to be caused in large part by the relatively wealthy buying up land as retirement/second homes. That trend, at least locally, seems remarkably unaffected by this recent economic downturn.</p><p>
And I don't see more people at farmers' market here because of the recent health scares, interestingly enough. We're just so rural -- often I think people here feel unaffected by what's going on in the world at large. I do think the situation will drastically change, though, as oil prices rise. I am just unsure how it will change. It will be interesting to watch. Gas hit $4.17 a gallon here at the cheapest station just yesterday.</p><p>
My ideal while I'm here, though, is to help make healthy local food available to regular folks. At the moment, this pretty much entails getting it into schools in the form of breakfasts and lunches, (a project that's consuming a fair bit of my nonworking time right now) and making it more available at convenient markets, from grocery stores to farmers' market. Additionally, the farmer I work for is trying a number of strategies to get herself out there into markets where normal people shop, and this diversified approach may yield some good results. I'll probably have more posts on on that at a later date.

<p>Stephanie</p></p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by treestump</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jul 2008 02:25:08 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/dispatches-from-the-fields-the-far-in-farmers-markets/6</guid>
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				<p><strong>profit to the mountain</strong></p><p>i know its cheesy play on words but i am a huge supporter of locally grown foods and i think if you organize the local farmers it is possible to get the locals in telluride and durango to drive the distance to buy your goods. organization of people and ideas is the key to reaching your goals think along the lines of a co-op. &nbsp;americans like to shop i say drive walmart out and use the building for a co-op cortez rocks and although some would complain about a 3 dollar bag of spinach you get what you pay for. i wouldnt think of feeding my family anything less i just teach my family to live without cell phones and ipods &nbsp; &nbsp;

<p>thank you</p></p>
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				<p><strong>profit to the mountain</strong></p><p>i know its cheesy play on words but i am a huge supporter of locally grown foods and i think if you organize the local farmers it is possible to get the locals in telluride and durango to drive the distance to buy your goods. organization of people and ideas is the key to reaching your goals think along the lines of a co-op. &nbsp;americans like to shop i say drive walmart out and use the building for a co-op cortez rocks and although some would complain about a 3 dollar bag of spinach you get what you pay for. i wouldnt think of feeding my family anything less i just teach my family to live without cell phones and ipods &nbsp; &nbsp;

<p>thank you</p></p>
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