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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for As farmers battle weeds &#8216;conventionally,&#8217; the chemical treadmill speeds up [UPDATED]]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Erik Hoffner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 06:54:40 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>Yes, there's a good bit of worry amongst farmers about the loss of glyphosate effectiveness due to Roundup Ready resistance. It's ironic. Monsanto said it was going to help farmers use less of this very effective if toxic substance, yet it's led to more, and may lead to its abandonment. - Erik, Orion Grassroots Network</p>
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				<p>Yes, there's a good bit of worry amongst farmers about the loss of glyphosate effectiveness due to Roundup Ready resistance. It's ironic. Monsanto said it was going to help farmers use less of this very effective if toxic substance, yet it's led to more, and may lead to its abandonment. - Erik, Orion Grassroots Network</p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Avelhingst</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:10:38 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>Thanks for displaying a prime example of alchemagrum jargobabble to the hoi palloi.&nbsp; See, alot of folks think a penchant for organic farming is courageous or that it requires more thought.&nbsp; Well, handling these sorts of chemicals takes far more courage than I can muster, and I prefer to think that organic agriculture doesn't take MORE thought, just a different kind of thinking.&nbsp; Also - I cannot fathom the reason why one would want to tie oneself to a burden of operating debt just to go out and buy vats of poisons that may or may not show a profit.&nbsp; Uff da.&nbsp;</p>
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				<p>Thanks for displaying a prime example of alchemagrum jargobabble to the hoi palloi.&nbsp; See, alot of folks think a penchant for organic farming is courageous or that it requires more thought.&nbsp; Well, handling these sorts of chemicals takes far more courage than I can muster, and I prefer to think that organic agriculture doesn't take MORE thought, just a different kind of thinking.&nbsp; Also - I cannot fathom the reason why one would want to tie oneself to a burden of operating debt just to go out and buy vats of poisons that may or may not show a profit.&nbsp; Uff da.&nbsp;</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by Tasermons Partner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 09:46:56 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/3</guid>
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				<p>What operating debt?</p><p>Corn, cotton, and soy are all heavily subsidized crops.&nbsp; If they actually had to pay for their own poisons, then maybe they would give it a second thought, but not so much when it's on Joe Taxpayer's dime.</p>
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				<p>What operating debt?</p><p>Corn, cotton, and soy are all heavily subsidized crops.&nbsp; If they actually had to pay for their own poisons, then maybe they would give it a second thought, but not so much when it's on Joe Taxpayer's dime.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by eleanordowling</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 10:12:35 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>Some organic farmers are really taking strides to be chemical free. Â <a href="http://changents.com/change-agents/OrganicNation.tv/vids-and-pics/21214/21441" rel="nofollow">This video has a neat example of one of them,Â courtesyÂ of Earthkeeper Change Agent Dorothee Royal-Hedinger and her org, OrganicNation.tvÂ </a></p>
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				<p>Some organic farmers are really taking strides to be chemical free. Â <a href="http://changents.com/change-agents/OrganicNation.tv/vids-and-pics/21214/21441" rel="nofollow">This video has a neat example of one of them,Â courtesyÂ of Earthkeeper Change Agent Dorothee Royal-Hedinger and her org, OrganicNation.tvÂ </a></p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by wanamoka</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 11:12:42 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>I got my degree in Ag back in 1980.&nbsp; The year I graduated I went and took a local community course on Organic Gardening because the university taught none of this.&nbsp; Everything was chemically related.&nbsp; I may be wrong here but I think many farmers rely on information from their county extension agents, who in turn get their killer herbicide information from the universities. &nbsp; Sure corporations are whipping this stuff out, but I would hazard a guess that university test plot studies like Tx A&amp;M help create the go no go on herbicides, pesticides, and GMO's.&nbsp;&nbsp; I will assume that there will be more than corn,cotton and soy crops that will be affected by this trend.&nbsp;&nbsp; What do you bet the corporations fund those PhD.'s research.</p>
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				<p>I got my degree in Ag back in 1980.&nbsp; The year I graduated I went and took a local community course on Organic Gardening because the university taught none of this.&nbsp; Everything was chemically related.&nbsp; I may be wrong here but I think many farmers rely on information from their county extension agents, who in turn get their killer herbicide information from the universities. &nbsp; Sure corporations are whipping this stuff out, but I would hazard a guess that university test plot studies like Tx A&amp;M help create the go no go on herbicides, pesticides, and GMO's.&nbsp;&nbsp; I will assume that there will be more than corn,cotton and soy crops that will be affected by this trend.&nbsp;&nbsp; What do you bet the corporations fund those PhD.'s research.</p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by amazingdrx</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jul 2009 22:04:29 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>Great video.&nbsp; I think robotics have great application in organic farming.&nbsp; Insect repellant/resistant plants placed in with crops, strip cropping, nitrogen fixing mulch crops like alfalfa between rows, muclching, pinpoint watering/organic fertilizer, robotic planting, harvesting, insect capture, and weed removal: all these applications acomplished with a renewably powered programmable robot would boost organic farming productivity far beyond chemical ag.<p>And vastly lower costs at the same time.&nbsp; Furthermore all the huge GHG releasse related to chemical ag would be eliominated (over half of human GHG is ag related).<p>A vast manufacturing base would be created, replacing the chemical, oil, and agribizz industries and huge, costly &nbsp;subsidy programs that are now involved in monopolizing the food supply.&nbsp; Healthcare costs would drop as dangerous substances are removed from the food chain, like antibiotics, hormones, pesticides, non-nutritive additives that boost obesity, and herbicides.<p><a href="http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog" rel="nofollow">http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog<p>The good jobs produced by the robotic farming industries and farms could replace those lost in conventional ag, chemical, and oil industries.&nbsp; Huge energy sources would be opened up from organic waste stream biodigesation and fertilizer and energy production.&nbsp; There is a whole new industry in itself, backing up renewable energy with waste stream biomass recycling.<p>Ask a college engineering team to work with their ag students on this, start a contest among&nbsp; schools as in other engineering challenges.&nbsp; simply managing a small garden with simple robotics at first, then on to&nbsp; planting..all the way to harvesting.&nbsp; Why not?&nbsp; or should we let chinese students pioneer this alone?&nbsp; Why shouldn't ours be onboard this re-evolution?</p></p></a></p></p></p></p>
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				<p>Great video.&nbsp; I think robotics have great application in organic farming.&nbsp; Insect repellant/resistant plants placed in with crops, strip cropping, nitrogen fixing mulch crops like alfalfa between rows, muclching, pinpoint watering/organic fertilizer, robotic planting, harvesting, insect capture, and weed removal: all these applications acomplished with a renewably powered programmable robot would boost organic farming productivity far beyond chemical ag.<p>And vastly lower costs at the same time.&nbsp; Furthermore all the huge GHG releasse related to chemical ag would be eliominated (over half of human GHG is ag related).<p>A vast manufacturing base would be created, replacing the chemical, oil, and agribizz industries and huge, costly &nbsp;subsidy programs that are now involved in monopolizing the food supply.&nbsp; Healthcare costs would drop as dangerous substances are removed from the food chain, like antibiotics, hormones, pesticides, non-nutritive additives that boost obesity, and herbicides.<p><a href="http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog" rel="nofollow">http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog<p>The good jobs produced by the robotic farming industries and farms could replace those lost in conventional ag, chemical, and oil industries.&nbsp; Huge energy sources would be opened up from organic waste stream biodigesation and fertilizer and energy production.&nbsp; There is a whole new industry in itself, backing up renewable energy with waste stream biomass recycling.<p>Ask a college engineering team to work with their ag students on this, start a contest among&nbsp; schools as in other engineering challenges.&nbsp; simply managing a small garden with simple robotics at first, then on to&nbsp; planting..all the way to harvesting.&nbsp; Why not?&nbsp; or should we let chinese students pioneer this alone?&nbsp; Why shouldn't ours be onboard this re-evolution?</p></p></a></p></p></p></p>
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            <title>Comment #7 by Javaman</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 22 Jul 2009 06:29:56 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>What monsanto is doing to the American farmer is what United Fruit did to Central American nations.</p><p>One day we will wake up and all the fields will be dead from mono-cropping and over saturation of chemicals. Monsanto will toss these farmers aside and move on to other lands to destroy. And god forbid the farmers actually try and stand up for themselves. monsanto's battery of lawyers will convert these farmers into the new poor to shut them up (it's already happening).</p><p>When you dance with the devil, don't be surprised if you don't only get burned but also flayed open for all the vultures to pick at your bones.</p>
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				<p>What monsanto is doing to the American farmer is what United Fruit did to Central American nations.</p><p>One day we will wake up and all the fields will be dead from mono-cropping and over saturation of chemicals. Monsanto will toss these farmers aside and move on to other lands to destroy. And god forbid the farmers actually try and stand up for themselves. monsanto's battery of lawyers will convert these farmers into the new poor to shut them up (it's already happening).</p><p>When you dance with the devil, don't be surprised if you don't only get burned but also flayed open for all the vultures to pick at your bones.</p>
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            <title>Comment #8 by Avelhingst</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 07:40:38 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-07-20-farmers-battle-weeds-chemical-treadmill-speeds/8</guid>
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				<p>Well, you see, the costs of the seasonal planting and pesticides and wages and tractor payments etcetera et cetera are not deferred; however, the money comes in from the sale of the crop and/or government programs usually in one lump or two at the end of the year.&nbsp; SO.... to cover the incurred costs, the traditional method is to take out large loans to cover the costs to be repaid - hopefully - after harvest.&nbsp; Really, we should think of the agricultural subsidy program as a bank subsidy, because all the programs do is make sure that the thousands of small banks scattered throughout the country side that prop up the big leveraged fellas in NYC do not face collapse in a poor year.</p>
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				<p>Well, you see, the costs of the seasonal planting and pesticides and wages and tractor payments etcetera et cetera are not deferred; however, the money comes in from the sale of the crop and/or government programs usually in one lump or two at the end of the year.&nbsp; SO.... to cover the incurred costs, the traditional method is to take out large loans to cover the costs to be repaid - hopefully - after harvest.&nbsp; Really, we should think of the agricultural subsidy program as a bank subsidy, because all the programs do is make sure that the thousands of small banks scattered throughout the country side that prop up the big leveraged fellas in NYC do not face collapse in a poor year.</p>
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