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	<title><![CDATA[Grist - Comment Feed for The bad and maybe not-so-bad of the  Waxman-Peterson deal]]></title>
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            <title>Comment #1 by Ken Johnson</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 11:52:11 -0700</pubDate>
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				<p>That's great -- offset credits from no-till farming, avoided deforestation, etc. so that industry can burn more coal. Doesn't that seem a little insane?</p>
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				<p>That's great -- offset credits from no-till farming, avoided deforestation, etc. so that industry can burn more coal. Doesn't that seem a little insane?</p>
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            <title>Comment #2 by Tom Philpott</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 12:03:47 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/2</guid>
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				<p>My analysis is strictly of the ag part. i'm extremely uncomfortable witht the coal concessions, but I'm told that no bill is possible without them, just as no bill is possible without goodies for Big Ag. It's profoundly depressing--but I haven't heard a better strategy for getting a climate framework in place.</p>
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				<p>My analysis is strictly of the ag part. i'm extremely uncomfortable witht the coal concessions, but I'm told that no bill is possible without them, just as no bill is possible without goodies for Big Ag. It's profoundly depressing--but I haven't heard a better strategy for getting a climate framework in place.</p>
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            <title>Comment #3 by ecoplasm</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:48:26 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/3</guid>
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				<p>"Don&rsquo;t panic&mdash;carbon offsets for going organic!"</p><p>OK, not a bad slogan. Offsets may not be the enemy of the people after all.</p><p>Wouldn't composting be a good thing to incentivize&nbsp;as well&nbsp;if we're pushing hard&nbsp;to promote&nbsp;organic ag as a possible beneficial outcome&nbsp;of this bill?&nbsp; Diverting food residuals and other organic wastes from landfills could lead to huge reductions in methane emisisons as well as provide nutrients and carbon sources for low input/high carbon agriculture.&nbsp; Unfortunately, the current&nbsp;WM bill takes away offset opportunties for composting by forcing the EPA to regulate landfill methane emissions through "performance standards", and the Peterson/Waxman amendments today&nbsp;don't&nbsp;address this.</p><p>California&nbsp;is making the same mistake&nbsp;by 'regulating' landfill methane&nbsp;emissions through performance standards.&nbsp;Frankly, the landfill giants are just loving it, since it&nbsp;is likely to provide&nbsp;a crooked but plausible-sounding justification for sending&nbsp;more organics to the landfill, not less (to produce more methane to help pay for the&nbsp;increased gas collection costs and keep 'rate payer' prices down through already subsidized renwable energy generation...).&nbsp; You will continue to hear the false argument that landfill gas collection is&nbsp;highly efficient&nbsp;and landfills will be formally rebranded as 'methane bioreactors'. Not good for composters or new anaerobic digestion technologies that can be much more efficient at methane reduction as well as capturing useful energy, both biological (compost) and chemical (methane).</p><p>Does the EPA&nbsp;really want this? How about we ask the group that&nbsp;pioneered the original landfill methane offset protocols&nbsp;for the EPA&nbsp;Climate Leaders Program (several years ago), or ask those&nbsp;who work for&nbsp;the Landfill Methane Outreach Program who have been actively anticipating and promoting&nbsp;environmental markets&nbsp;for years, or ask the Reduce, Reuse and Recycle folks in the EPA Office of Resource Conservation and Recovery, or even ask the&nbsp;really smart&nbsp;people in the EPA Office of Climate&nbsp;Change (they practically invented offset policy).&nbsp; Is it a good idea for a few special interest groups to second-guess the EPA on whether offsets might actually be sound policy for this sector?</p><p>I think a lot more people, once they see through the trees, will&nbsp;understand that offset policy is what you make of it (and not necessarily the devil's weed); wouldn't it be funny if Monsanto, as a&nbsp;capped entity,&nbsp;ended up funding the widespread development of organic agriculture in the US through the purchase of offsets from organic farmers, as overseen and&nbsp;encouraged by an Obama administration run USDA?</p><p>Sounds pretty not-so-bad to me.</p>
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				<p>"Don&rsquo;t panic&mdash;carbon offsets for going organic!"</p><p>OK, not a bad slogan. Offsets may not be the enemy of the people after all.</p><p>Wouldn't composting be a good thing to incentivize&nbsp;as well&nbsp;if we're pushing hard&nbsp;to promote&nbsp;organic ag as a possible beneficial outcome&nbsp;of this bill?&nbsp; Diverting food residuals and other organic wastes from landfills could lead to huge reductions in methane emisisons as well as provide nutrients and carbon sources for low input/high carbon agriculture.&nbsp; Unfortunately, the current&nbsp;WM bill takes away offset opportunties for composting by forcing the EPA to regulate landfill methane emissions through "performance standards", and the Peterson/Waxman amendments today&nbsp;don't&nbsp;address this.</p><p>California&nbsp;is making the same mistake&nbsp;by 'regulating' landfill methane&nbsp;emissions through performance standards.&nbsp;Frankly, the landfill giants are just loving it, since it&nbsp;is likely to provide&nbsp;a crooked but plausible-sounding justification for sending&nbsp;more organics to the landfill, not less (to produce more methane to help pay for the&nbsp;increased gas collection costs and keep 'rate payer' prices down through already subsidized renwable energy generation...).&nbsp; You will continue to hear the false argument that landfill gas collection is&nbsp;highly efficient&nbsp;and landfills will be formally rebranded as 'methane bioreactors'. Not good for composters or new anaerobic digestion technologies that can be much more efficient at methane reduction as well as capturing useful energy, both biological (compost) and chemical (methane).</p><p>Does the EPA&nbsp;really want this? How about we ask the group that&nbsp;pioneered the original landfill methane offset protocols&nbsp;for the EPA&nbsp;Climate Leaders Program (several years ago), or ask those&nbsp;who work for&nbsp;the Landfill Methane Outreach Program who have been actively anticipating and promoting&nbsp;environmental markets&nbsp;for years, or ask the Reduce, Reuse and Recycle folks in the EPA Office of Resource Conservation and Recovery, or even ask the&nbsp;really smart&nbsp;people in the EPA Office of Climate&nbsp;Change (they practically invented offset policy).&nbsp; Is it a good idea for a few special interest groups to second-guess the EPA on whether offsets might actually be sound policy for this sector?</p><p>I think a lot more people, once they see through the trees, will&nbsp;understand that offset policy is what you make of it (and not necessarily the devil's weed); wouldn't it be funny if Monsanto, as a&nbsp;capped entity,&nbsp;ended up funding the widespread development of organic agriculture in the US through the purchase of offsets from organic farmers, as overseen and&nbsp;encouraged by an Obama administration run USDA?</p><p>Sounds pretty not-so-bad to me.</p>
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            <title>Comment #4 by Tasermons Partner</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 16:58:26 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/4</guid>
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				<p>I'm not all that worried on the ethanol front.</p><p>My personal "magic 8-ball" prediction is that ethanol won't pan out as the "miracle fuel" Big Ag thinks it'll be.</p><p>And by the time they can get their heads outta the corn-planted soils to realize it, cars will be much more fuel efficient and hopefully most will have at least some kinda hybrid system that will make very large-scale increases in ethanol production unlikely.</p>
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				<p>I'm not all that worried on the ethanol front.</p><p>My personal "magic 8-ball" prediction is that ethanol won't pan out as the "miracle fuel" Big Ag thinks it'll be.</p><p>And by the time they can get their heads outta the corn-planted soils to realize it, cars will be much more fuel efficient and hopefully most will have at least some kinda hybrid system that will make very large-scale increases in ethanol production unlikely.</p>
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            <title>Comment #5 by Gar Lipow</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jun 2009 19:48:20 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/5</guid>
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				<p>You know money for organic agriculture is a good thing, but if that money comes from offsets sold by organic farms started in 2001 that is not actually helping the climate. That comes pretty close to meeting the classic definition of non-additionality.</p>
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				<p>You know money for organic agriculture is a good thing, but if that money comes from offsets sold by organic farms started in 2001 that is not actually helping the climate. That comes pretty close to meeting the classic definition of non-additionality.</p>
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            <title>Comment #6 by Meredith Niles</title>
			<link>http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 04:56:01 -0700</pubDate>
			<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.grist.org/article/2009-06-25-not-bad-waxman/6</guid>
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				<p>Ecoplasm- you right.&nbsp; Composting is a good thing to be pushing not only for reducing nitrogen fertilizer use but for reducing waste streams to landfills which emit methane.&nbsp; Actually just 2 days ago the city of San Francisco introduced a mandatory composting policy (<a href="http://www.reuters.com/article/gwmCarbonEmissions/idUS401768193520090623" rel="nofollow">http://www.reuters.com/article/gwmCarbonEmissions/idUS401768193520090623) and many groups in Washington, including mine-- The Center for Food Safety-- have been advocating for composting initiatives for this reason.</a></p>
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				<p>Ecoplasm- you right.&nbsp; Composting is a good thing to be pushing not only for reducing nitrogen fertilizer use but for reducing waste streams to landfills which emit methane.&nbsp; Actually just 2 days ago the city of San Francisco introduced a mandatory composting policy (<a href="http://www.reuters.com/article/gwmCarbonEmissions/idUS401768193520090623" rel="nofollow">http://www.reuters.com/article/gwmCarbonEmissions/idUS401768193520090623) and many groups in Washington, including mine-- The Center for Food Safety-- have been advocating for composting initiatives for this reason.</a></p>
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