Grist - Comment Feed for States left wondering about EPA’s greenhouse gas ruling

Comment #1 by Subaru

Sat, 18 Apr 2009 08:54:15 -0700

We hear about climate changes for last few years. USA will not do anything about it, they have huge industry which cant be changed over night. Obama will probably like to change it, but he cant. He just got president and we all know that this means he got powers, but not all powers. There are people above him and that people just want money and dont care about climate changes.

Comment #2 by Clifford Wells

Sat, 18 Apr 2009 11:34:13 -0700

I don't know how this is going to work, since a greenhouse gas rule only applies to a manufacturer's sales within a state for new vehicles - not the entire fleet. I haven't seen people buying a lot of cars lately so I doubt it would have a huge effect, even if passed everywhere in the US today.

There's an old joke that the CAFE standards were so loose that you could drive a truck through them (haha, or a SUV!). Corporate averaging, banking, and trading (ABT) are allowed and while you might think there is one number like "44 MPG," you're wrong (but in a very amusing way).

Then we still have to reconcile with the fact that greenhouse gas emissions from even electric cars usually involve greenhouse gasses at the power plant, unless you're only drawing dedicated power from hydro, nuke, solar, or wind power. Suffice it to say, the greenhouse gas emissions for plug-in vehicles are not zero. But that's an "indirect, life-cycle" consideration we can but off for a few years I think.

Myself, I would rather see EPA regulate vehicles in terms of CO2, N2O, and CH4 in terms of grams per mile for light-duty and grams per horsepower-hour on heavy-duty. Let's not be confused with energy programs for consuming petroleum fuels when we're really talking about reducing the three major greenhouse gasses. It might sound like a trivial point but it is simpler, and the emissions relate to the various driving cycles used for certification and durability and recall rather than on one very simple "fuel economy" driving cycle that EPA recently revised. -sam

Comment #3 by The Elderly Geek

Sat, 18 Apr 2009 13:31:43 -0700

I think green is great, but as long as we let polluting industries buy so called credits from other industries, we will have pollution. Rick Used Dyson Vacuum Cleaners

Comment #4 by Tasermons Partner

Sun, 19 Apr 2009 13:31:19 -0700

Just have some patience. It's been expected for awhile now that the EPA would issue the "danger to public health" papers and THEN set 'bout respondin' to the states' stricter emissions standards requests. They should allow the waivers within a few months.

Comment #5 by greeniemeanie

Mon, 20 Apr 2009 01:25:42 -0700

The California exception (which is the only exception allowed under the Clean Air Act) works this way. California applies for an exception waiver, and if it's granted, the other states have the option of adopting the federal standard, or the higher California standard. The first step is that the federal government has to do adopt a standard. Bush claimed he couldn't. The states, led by California, sued. The Supreme Court told Bush's EPA they could. Then, Bush's EPA turned around and denied the exception waiver (first time) and California entered into another lawsuit. New administration: they're following the steps. Finding that GHGs are dangerous first, addressing the non decision made by Bush's EPA. Then there's the California waiver, and the 13 states who have said they want to adopt it. They constitute about 1/2 of the auto makers market. Yeah, a resident of one of those states can go over the border and buy a car, but it's 1/2 of the auto makers market. From what I understand, the California Air Resources Board has been negotiating with the feds to make the transition smooth. And that's the big mystery... they're trying to make a deal... but unless Ahnold goes back to the Legislature and changes California law, the exception waiver request will have to remain essentially the same.