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VF on the Tesla Roadster
Michael Shnayerson, who literally wrote the book on the ill-fated GM EV1, has an excellent piece in last month's Vanity Fair about the Tesla Roadster.
Quoting is redundant -- the whole article is fun and packed with attention to personal detail. Eventually, someone is going to have to write a biography of Alan Cocconi, who seems to be at the center of all the electric car efforts of the last quarter-century or so.
John McGrath is an intinerant student and sometimes reporter currently living in Toronto, Canada. He mainly writes about Canadian and International Politics from an energy and climate perspective
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GreyFlcn Posted 1:14 pm
14 May 2007
Gives ya some of the gritty details and serendipity about how the Tesla Roadster came into being.
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amazingdrx Posted 11:52 pm
14 May 2007
Any of these with one quarter the batteries and a backup generator that runs on regular from any gas station would average 10% of the gas consumption of a regular car.
Oil and GHG problems nearly solved. Why hasn't this been acomplished? Do an article on that VF. Or any other mass delusional media outlet, please?
It's an important topic, especially going into the '08 election/bribery cycle.
http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog
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Steven T Posted 12:17 am
15 May 2007
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amazingdrx Posted 1:02 am
15 May 2007
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2007/05/tesla ...
The combustion engine in the Chevy Volt can run on gas, ethanol, hydrogen, or biodiesel (customers will choose one),
Wrong, the hydrogen version substitutes a fuel cell for the ICE (internal combustion engine)generator. A ridiculous concept. The hydrogen economy is complete propaganda by the oily corporate status quosters to keep gas guzzling going until the last drop of oil is sold for a billion dollars.
This is a car of the future, literally, since it's based on battery technology that experts believe won't exist for another half-decade.
Wrong again, the volt would work just fine on available A123 or altairnano lithium ion batteries. In fact it would even work with nearly obsolete nickle metal hydride batteries.
As the article states the EV1's lead acid batteries weighed 1,150 pounds. A 40 mile range with these antiques would weigh around 500 pounds. Even that would not have been a design breaker. Put a 30 kw ICE generator in an EV1 with that half sized battery pack and 40 mile battery only range and the weight would be less than the original lead acid EV1. The range would be unlimited because when the batteries died the ICE generator would take over, and it is powered by widely available gas.
http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog
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mulad Posted 6:35 am
15 May 2007
I agree that an electric with an auxiliary power unit as in the Volt is a good idea though, allowing the flexibility to go on long trips when necessary.
I think that the apparent mention of a hydrogen "engine" for the Volt is probably just because the writer was attempting to save a little space and avoid getting into an unnecessary discussion about fuel cells.
Yes, the math doesn't make much sense for GM saying Volt batteries aren't possible. However, you have to look at all of the requirements they've set out: a 16kWh pack fitting into a certain volume (which I forget), weighing 400 pounds, and able to handle about 4000 charge cycles. Current battery technology reaches most of these targets, except perhaps for the 4000-charge number. They also want to have batteries which would only require passive cooling rather than the active (liquid-based) cooling which is used in other vehicles like the Tesla Roadster.
Are they trying to make the task seem impossible by wishing away problems that could be easily solved by simple engineering? Well, yeah, probably...
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GreyFlcn Posted 10:16 am
15 May 2007
We already have those batteries.
Hell, their even being sold inside power tools right now.
http://www.dewalt.com/36v/
Current battery technology reaches most of these targets, except perhaps for the 4000-charge number.
A123 Systems offer 9,000 deep charge cycles
AltairNano has over 25,000+ deep charge cycles
They also want to have batteries which would only require passive cooling rather than the active (liquid-based) cooling which is used in other vehicles like the Tesla Roadster.
Altair has an operating temperature range of -50°F to 170°F
It needs no active cooling system.
It'd imagine A123 is similar.
Altair CEO Podcast
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/05/07/autobloggreen-qan ...
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And GM has already signed a contract with A123 Systems to use their batteries.
http://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/18054/page2/
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So no, it's not at all about not having the batteries.
Which is partially why I'm so skeptical about GM since they keep repeating that "we don't have the batteries"
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mulad Posted 1:53 am
16 May 2007
Then, the batteries need to last the life of an average car (what, 15 to 18 years?), or probably at least the half-life of an average car (7-10). There are a lot of simulations that can be done, but that's something that won't be known for certain until the cars have been on the road for a while. Misjudged, it could end up being a huge cost to the company in the future, depending on how warranties are structured.
So yeah, to GM, it all comes down to how much money they'll either need to spend to cover repairs (though more likely, they're worried about losing repair income they currently get).
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GreyFlcn Posted 4:22 am
16 May 2007
Plenty to fill the prerequisite 10 year warranty.
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